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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
Join date : 2013-07-02
Age : 55

PostSubject: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:52 am

Hi All
I have an issue with my 2006 GRiSO 1100.
This is stock down to the handlebars & has Beetles map installed.

Used to start perfectly now it takes nearly the 4 seconds to start and sometimes I need to hit the button a second time.
When it starts there is no power there, a bit like when the choke isn't on on a carby bike, turn throttle and nothing there.
Ride down the road for say two kms and all good, stop restart all ok, so when hot runs like it should.
This issue has progressively gotten worse as time goes on.
Had new plugs (outer 8000kms ago)
Will need an air clearer next service, popped it out and starting the same.
I did notice that when I installed the map it did start slower but I have had the map in for sometime and wouldn't think a map can change by its self.(can it)

Any help is much appreciated.

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ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo


Posts : 1692
Join date : 2014-05-22
Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:13 am

Sounds like a super lean condition that is more of a problem when cold.
Besides whatever the guru's tell you to do with mapping/trims etc, make sure all the hose clamps on your rubber inlet manifolds are tight. THEY DO COME LOOSE.
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


Posts : 3959
Join date : 2013-09-30

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:48 am

Harry, pull your plugs and tell me what they look like please.
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


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Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:49 am

Wayne
Mate a beers on me when ever I see you.
Spot on, loose rubber manifold rubber.
How cool is this site, I was pulling what hair I have out and thinking some major issue which I do not need at the moment.
Hit the button and bang started right up.
Will test ride tomorrow but I think that's what it was.
Thanks again mate.
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


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Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:51 am

Hi Beetle
Wayne looks like he got it with the manifolds, see above.
One question, can a map change by itself as I thought it may have?
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


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PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 2:06 am

No mate. Thumbs Up
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ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo


Posts : 1692
Join date : 2014-05-22
Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:50 am

Grisodude wrote:

One question, can a map change by itself as I thought it may have?

GRiSO, he is alive! No?
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Ralf z
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 315
Join date : 2014-01-02
Age : 49

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:08 pm

Good result Harry..
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ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo


Posts : 1692
Join date : 2014-05-22
Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:00 pm

Hey Mark, I been thinking (bloody dangerous at the best of times, worse in this 40 degree heat).
In your tutorial of how to plug and play with mapping/trims etc. It maybe good to suggest "tightening of the 8 inlet manifold hose clamps before starting the process".

I'm assuming it could play havoc with TB sync and idle mixtures if 1 or more clamps were letting air in.

My experience with two EFI Guzzi's (Cali Stone & Bellagio) that within 10,000km intervals I will notice either hard starting a cold motor, or more noticeably a backfire thru the inlets on start up. Will also spit back thru the inlet when moving off from stationary, as in developing a flat spot just off idle and when cold.
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


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PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 10:51 pm

Wayne, IIRC, somewhere amongst all my contentious & pretentious pontificating, I'm sure I said something along the lines of: The assumption is that the bike is in a good state of tune and is mechanically sound.

I reckon that covers everything. Very Happy
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ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo


Posts : 1692
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Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:01 pm

Sure does, but I'm surprised by the number of Guzzi owners who don't check these things as part of normal servicing. Failure to do so prior to re-flashing may have people blaming something else (or someone else) for their hickups. As per our now hairless Harry.
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


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PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:24 pm

It's normal to suspect the last thing that was fiddled with.
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Andy in NZ
Grignapoco
Grignapoco


Posts : 100
Join date : 2014-02-15

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:57 pm

I agree with Beetle. I usually find its the last thing I touched or mucked with is the issue.
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Steak
L'Innominato
L'Innominato


Posts : 1905
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Age : 51

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Tue Jan 27, 2015 7:09 am

ghezzi wrote:
Hey Mark, I been thinking (bloody dangerous at the best of times, worse in this 40 degree heat).
In your tutorial of how to plug and play with mapping/trims etc. It maybe good to suggest "tightening of the 8 inlet manifold hose clamps before starting the process".

I'm assuming it could play havoc with TB sync and idle mixtures if 1 or more clamps were letting air in.

My experience with two EFI Guzzi's (Cali Stone & Bellagio) that within 10,000km intervals I will notice either hard starting a cold motor, or more noticeably a backfire thru the inlets on start up. Will also spit back thru the inlet when moving off from stationary, as in developing a flat spot just off idle and when cold.

This is a great reminder Ghezzi, I'm gong to try to remember to check mine at every service interval, because I don't...

Embarassed

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2012 MOTO GUZZI GRiSO 1200SE

2013 MOTO GUZZI STELVIO 1200NTX - Orange Blossom Special
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
Join date : 2013-07-02
Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Tue Jan 27, 2015 11:18 pm

Hi Guys
Must have been a warm bike when I said it was fixed.
Rode to work this morning and it was much the same as before, maybe a touch better.
The clamps were loose no doubt about that and will be check at service times form now on.
Any more ideas. attached photo of plug.
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It takes no time to run ok, just the starting is running to long and hesitation before warmed up.
I'll get new plugs tomorrow and see if that makes any difference.
Harry had a smile but it has gone and back to scratching his head.
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ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo


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Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Tue Jan 27, 2015 11:29 pm

Stepper motor related?
And go reset all your Co2 trims, TPS & T/B sync etc. (after the testicle clamps were tightened)
Bugger it, start with your tappets and do a full tune along with those new spark plugs.
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The Saint
Biondino
Biondino


Posts : 238
Join date : 2014-12-04

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:58 am

Me GRiSO was like that from day one. Even after the full tune, somewhat. I put it down to lean starting.
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ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo


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Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:17 am

Hey Al, when you fit your Ago and do the Beetle flash, can I watch (& learn)?
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The Saint
Biondino
Biondino


Posts : 238
Join date : 2014-12-04

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:46 am

No dramas mate. I'll come over to yours and do it. I'm yet to obtaind the cables and software though.
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
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Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Fri Jan 30, 2015 2:27 pm

Well
New plugs in and started this morning and no issues, rode away ok.
Also did the ECU reset battery terminal removed thing.
I know shouldn't do two things at once as now I don't know which it was.
One thing I did notice was the revs didn't go up to 2000rpm and back again as it had been.
But if the bike can live with that I can. Very Happy
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


Posts : 3959
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PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Fri Jan 30, 2015 2:38 pm

Harry, your old plug looked a bit likes she's running on the rich side.

What have you got your CO trim set at? Did I send you the latest 1100 map?
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
Join date : 2013-07-02
Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Sat Jan 31, 2015 2:11 pm

Hi beetle
No first map you did for the 1100 is installed.CO trim is -10 I think off the top of my head.
Can't see as I had to reset my laptop back to factory settings and now it goes to installation unsuccessful.
If you have another map I would like it I'll PM my e-mail.
Anyone know how to get around this instal problem.
I'm known for when shit happens I get get it in truck loads.Smile
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
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Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Sun Feb 01, 2015 3:02 am

Hi all
How cool I worked out the prob with the lap top.
Had no driver for the cables, I'm pretty impressed with myself.
Then I stuffed up the PM to Beetle, I sent it to myself.
Oh well smart one minute and dumb the next.
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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
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Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:29 am

Nar not impressed anymore.
No joke every time I think its ok the next morning it's the same.
Tighten manifolds as they were loose.
New spark plugs.
Done the tappets
Thought the air cleaner maybe the problem, took it out and no started the same.
Have new map,thanks Mark and will hopefully install when I get a new air filter.
Now I connect the laptop and it will not connect, I get no ECU on the dash.
Cables worked before but not now F$%k.
What controls the starting circuit in these bikes?
And when warm goes like stink, top gear 2000rmp and pulls away no issues.
I'll get there sooner a later.

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Grisodude
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


Posts : 311
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Age : 55

PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Thu May 07, 2015 4:08 am

Guys been a while, busy with kids and grand kids.

Got my Guzzidiag working as OZ1200GUZZi Tony said maybe the driver was not installed, yep correct Tony thanks all good now.

Cleaned the throttle bodies on the bike, then Voulga77 PM'ed me and said that the best way is take them off.Thanks Voulga77

Well bit the bullet and did it last rainy weekend, here is a photo of the cleaned on bike throttle body.

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Next is off the bike and shows the other side. YUK

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Here is some of the crap.

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Had oil in the air filter box, to much in the motor, and Mr Ropers tip if grinding one side of the dipstick works a treat.
Not hard to to at all, if you have ever taken a carby off and cleaned it you can do this no worries.

Did it solve my starting issue, No but I find if I give it one twist of the throttle while its turning over it starts up no worries, then needs minute and all good to ride and will start no worries when warm.
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PostSubject: Re: Starting issue   Today at 10:04 pm

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