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 Fork Swap Idea

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Birch
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PostSubject: Fork Swap Idea   Fri Mar 20, 2015 9:56 am

Just thinking out loud here.

I'm not really liking my front forks very much. I've got the 3 bears syndrome here where it's too harsh, but sharp, to mushy yet comfortable.

So I was thinking about the 43mm Showa that's on a Ducati 1198. Or is it the same fork?
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:33 am

The Showas are actually a very good fork and are extremely 'Tunable'. They also have the advantage that because they are stock fitment on every Japanese Sportsbike built since God was a boy most suspension experts can set them up in their sleep!

Interestingly on our run to Gloucester yesterday, a 750Km jaunt over some fairly goaty goat tracks, it was immediately evident how much better my forks, which I've had set up by my local suspension expert, we're working than Mark or Ralf's. Mark's in particular were obviously running way too much HS compression damping, you could tell it from his headlight! Ralf's forks have been re-oiled with lighter oil I believe and he rides a lot quicker than me so I didn't get to observe his much from in front but that's simply because he's a much better rider, (And I habitually ride like the grandfather of the oldest man in the world!).

As well as being re-valved mine run thinner, and less, oil and I have the spring preload cranked way up! I'm really happy with the way mine behaves now. I have bought a set of Ohlins for it but what with the hassle of having to make custom yokes for them I've decided that for me they would be a waste so if anybody wants a set I have one for sale.

If you want to avoid the hassle of custom yokes another alternative might be the Sachs forks from an RSV4. While they would obviously need setting up for a great, fat, pig like a GRiSO you can get tuning kits that make them perform *almost* as well as Ohlins. It's that tiny percentage in difference that makes serious racers and track day tragics swap out the forks for Ohlins but that means that the Sachs units are coming up on fleabay from time to time and I believe they are dimensionally identical to the GRiSO's Showas. Make sure you confirm that before buying though!

For me the greatest advantage to getting one's suspension 'Right' is not so much how much better the bike will handle. Quite frankly even a less than perfect GRiSO is a lot better than me! The important factor is fatigue. You can ride harder, longer and still get off feeling fresh rather than just having gone ten rounds with Mike Tyson! At my age that is VERY important!

Pete
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:40 am

Thanks, Pete.

Well, I'm in Chicago. There has to be a decent suspension guy somewhere near here... I hope. Because a re-valving dialing in sounds way better than a swap. That being said, some Ohilns would "Look" cool.

Time to freeze my arse off on a ride.
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rboe
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sun Mar 22, 2015 4:56 pm

I had a local guy (racer pilot and shop owner) tune my GRiSO after I rode Chris's GRiSO (his was tuned by the same fellow). OHMG! Best $30 I've ever spent. Best money I've ever spent on a bike.

Having a tunable suspension is nice, but it's like having a piano. You need to know how to play it.

I'm pretty sure you can have your folks tuned up (and in any event, if you bought upgraded forks, they be worthless until you tuned THEM) and you will be quite happy with them then. Worst case, they will be tonnes better, but after a bit, still not good enough and you can upgrade. But I think the worst case will be that you'll ride them for a long time before you feel any need to upgrade.
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sun Mar 22, 2015 6:13 pm

Depends how heavy you guys are.
I'm 175lbs and the OEM works fine for me even in a track situation, which I had fun testing. lol
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rboe
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sun Mar 22, 2015 7:20 pm

Good point, I'm 165.
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Mon Mar 23, 2015 6:13 am

I'm 220 and seem to go from mushy brake diving vagueness to pogoing on every crack in the road.

And, well, I have a bit of fork envy. A guy in town has an R9t and those gold tubes look fantastic.
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cytocycle
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sat Apr 04, 2015 7:25 pm

if they are just mushy, you need new fork springs and oil and get the stockers tuned. I'm 185 and the stock forks work well, I might still kit them for better sensitivity to match my Ohlins rear but I've done fork swaps and it's a total pain in the ass. Good to know that RSV shocks fit the yokes and are the same length that's half the battle.
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Wed Aug 31, 2016 11:26 am

So found this. Looks like I have had this idea for awhile.

A Sachs set off an RSV4 would be drop in and go?
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Wed Aug 31, 2016 11:41 am

Don't think so. I believe the tops of the forks are smaller. I have a set that I may or may not end up sticking on my bike along with a set of Ohlins and there are minor differences. I don't have them with me obviously and can't remember the exact details.

I'm worn earring if the Matris internals will fit in them? Not for any build superiority but simply because they are golden and very pretty! Very Happy
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Wed Aug 31, 2016 3:11 pm

Yep. Kinda where I am at.

There has to be the measurements online somewhere.

I have a nice box of amazing monoblocs for my axial GRiSO now. Just sitting there.
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ghezzi
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Wed Aug 31, 2016 9:31 pm

Birch, another possibility is you can buy fork bottoms, as in the axle/caliper holder.
Get a pair from the GRiSO 1200 and have them fitted.

Everything fits, everything works.

Have a Matris cartridge kit fitted at the same time, a better result & cheaper alternative to a complete front end swap which is a long way from plug-n-play.

AF1 part # 978455 and 978456 are 1200 GRiSO left and right fork leg bottoms including the stanchion (chromed leg), only USD$175 each.
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Wed Aug 31, 2016 9:57 pm

Actually thinking about that I might have the pair off the bottom of the legs off the wreck. You could just swap them onto your lowers. I won't be able to tell for sure until October though.....
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Thu Sep 01, 2016 6:55 am

Pete, that would be great!

This will be a winter project for me along with a Matris job.

I was looking at the lower fork on mine yesterday wondering if this was an option.

Thanks!!
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:59 am

So I keep leaning toward this.

What are all the measurements I need to make to have this happen?

I have a friend that has a CNC machine shop who thinks that if we have all the right measurements, he can help design and make the triples.

Thinking the Tuono or RSV Ohilns
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Fri Oct 14, 2016 8:20 pm

The Tuono ones would be a nice swap.
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Birch
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sat Oct 29, 2016 8:09 am

Found a few sets on eBay.

Look to be drop in, but there is now way it is that easy, right?
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sat Oct 29, 2016 10:32 am

You have to do some measuring and it probably won't be cheap. I have a set of Ohlins to try on mine, I had to bore a bottom yoke out by a mm and make shims for the top, one of the caps needed replacing and I paid to have my local suspension bloke go through them. All up cost about 1.8K

I also have a set of Sachs off a Tuono I'm going to play with. They need shims for the top.

Matris inserts alone for your current forks will transform them. There is nothing wrong with Showas, it's simply they aren't set up very well stock. Grossly under sprung and over damped.

Pete
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pauldaytona
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sat Oct 29, 2016 3:04 pm

I think the ohlins triples from tuono/rsv would fit. Same head bearing size. Only look for mounting steeringlock/key/dashboard. RSV/Tuono öhlins are 56/51mm bottom/top mount. I have the triple here on my desk.
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Sat Oct 29, 2016 6:54 pm

Nice paper weights Paul.
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PostSubject: Re: Fork Swap Idea   Today at 9:44 pm

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