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 Another oncoming tappet failure?

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Pete Roper
GRiSO
GRiSO


Posts : 3783
Join date : 2013-05-29
Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 3:56 am

I'm in a real adage over Ralf's bike right now. At the moment I'm planning to try just re-shelling it but I have to make sure the oil pump gear hasn't shattered.

I'm planning on sticking the new shells in and reassembling with lots of assembly lube then 'll spin it on the starter with the plugs out and get Ian to stick his filthy digit over the oil pick-up hole. As long as it has some 'Suck' I'll go ahead and replace the sump, filter etc. and pray that when it lights up it'll be good.

Ralf is far from a rich bloke and his failure was sudden rather than ongoing. I'm hoping his rods haven't had a chance to ovalise and the bearing wear wasn't so bad that I think the decks hit the head. I reckon it's worth a try but I can give no guarantees. The 8V isn't yer old Holden Red Motor......

Pete
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John Lyon
Tanabuso
Tanabuso


Posts : 50
Join date : 2014-02-01

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:15 am

Pete Roper wrote:
The factory will under no circumstances offer a 'Pre-emptive' replacement. This is why I'm strongly recommending people suck up the out of pocket expense to have their tappets inspected. It's no skin off my nose if people don't and believe me I'm never going to be farting through silk on the profits of pulling cam boxes! Look, pulling the left box takes me about an hour and a half max. Chances are damage will be evident and a claim can be put in IF you have a FSH. At least then you'll know and to me that is a lot more important to be aware of so if damage is apparent you can cease riding forthwith and avoid the risk of cumulative damage.

Pete

Will do.  My 6,000 mile service is due soon (I know, I need to ride more), so I'll just add the cost of a left side inspection to each service going forward.  Thanks, Pete, your advice is most appreciated.
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John Lyon
Tanabuso
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PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:21 am

Ralf z wrote:
My advice,
Just replace the fuckers.
Don't wait or look into a crystal ball.
Preventive maintenance is much cheaper than my position right now.

I hear you. Best of luck with it.
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little750
Grignapoco
Grignapoco


Posts : 194
Join date : 2014-05-07
Age : 61

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:43 am

Mines was still running great and the tappets hadn’t needed adjustment for the last 10000 miles but wear was still apparent on the right side followers. Now it is rollerized it should be good.
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mark111
Grignapoco
Grignapoco


Posts : 187
Join date : 2014-04-23

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:43 am

Couldn't agree more with Ralf's comments above, don't play Piaggio LOTTO you are very unlikely to be a winner.
It is obvious the don't give a shit and are morally bereft or they would have owned up years ago and made it viable for all flat tappet owners to upgrade to rollers before catastrophic damage occurs.
Even the inevitable minor damage should not have to occur before parts are provide as even this can lead to unnecessary engine damage.
They are so dumb as shit they think this won't have a long term impact on the brand.
This issue has caused me so much angst that I'm not sure I will ever buy another Piaggio product again, don't these dumb fucks realise ther are 30 other brands out ther and most of them are cheaper to buy and keep on the road.
As I said in another post I am fortunate to know some good people associated with this brand who have helped to limit the significant financial pain and restore some confidence in my current bike.
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LBC Tenni
Nibbio
Nibbio


Posts : 502
Join date : 2014-06-05

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 1:26 pm

My sentiments exactly Mark. I love my GRiSO and will keep it for a long time. But Piaggio can shit and fall back in it, as far as I'm concerned. And considering their new offerings to replace the GRiSO, we won't be missing anything worthwhile by pretending they don't exist. Bunch of empty Italian suits running that mob.


Last edited by LBC Tenni on Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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Ralf z
Tiradritto
Tiradritto


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Age : 49

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 2:41 pm

I'm very lucky like Mark said to have great people on my side.
My bike is staying with me, whether Petes fix works or not.
As I couldn't flick it on to someone and walk away.
Unlike piaggio.
It will be fixed maybe today or maybe next year.
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Cereal KLR
Carlotto
Carlotto


Posts : 39
Join date : 2015-10-12

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 3:45 pm

Well this is a pisser. My buddy wants to sell me his 09 Stelvio but has no idea about these prickly issues. I tell him he has unsellable bike without major repairs or let him find out the hard way?

This will be a tough conversation between friends.
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


Posts : 3976
Join date : 2013-09-30

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:22 pm

That's a pickle KLR. An '09 is going to likely need the C kit. If he's your buddy, a frank and honest discussion should ensue. Perhaps you can come to an an agreement that allows you to buy the bike and buy the kit? It will mean less bucks for him. For sure, if he is your buddy, you can't let him find out the had way?
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Cereal KLR
Carlotto
Carlotto


Posts : 39
Join date : 2015-10-12

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:32 pm

Anyone have a ballpark $$ cost for a C kit is falling USA currency? I used to build diesel engines/transmissions/differentials so these are not difficult vehicles to work over. Maybe we could help each other out, he buys kit I do rework type thing.

I will wait until we have a couple beers first before I show him this thread lol.

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Lenz9753
Tanabuso
Tanabuso


Posts : 87
Join date : 2015-06-16

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 6:02 pm

Thanks for the kit ID pics Mark and your info Pete
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beetle
GRiSO
GRiSO


Posts : 3976
Join date : 2013-09-30

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:46 pm

AF1:

Kit B

Kit C


Kit C can be made from Kit B plus the extra bits for less money.
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Cereal KLR
Carlotto
Carlotto


Posts : 39
Join date : 2015-10-12

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 8:06 pm

Ok thanks, I'll bring it up to him this weekend. He bought it used from a dealership that has full service info on it maybe it was done, nah he never gets that lucky...

After parts swap is there any indicator evident, stamping or anything visual to show the difference?
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Pete Roper
GRiSO
GRiSO


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Join date : 2013-05-29
Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 9:01 pm

For general information it is worth remembering that fluctuations in exchange rates can make a HUGE difference.

A year ago it was cheaper for me to buy, rather than get warranty, a kit from the USA. Today the opposite is true!

Just having compared the prices of kits

If you buy in from the US, (Which for Aussies used to be advantageous.) at retail price.

'B' Kit-US$1081.36which translates into $AU1479.57

'C' Kit-US$1485.12which translates to $AU2051.21

From our importer.

'B' Kit-$AU1230.86

'C' Kit-$AU1503.97

Also anything bought in from overseas will get import duty and 10% GST slapped on it.

Obviously having done the hard years and the sums if people want to buy on their own dime I'd be overjoyed if they buy from me but the same will apply at any dealer.

They actually have at least one 'C' kit in stock here so if anyone needs one let me know but at the moment I seem to have a conga-line of worn out shitters I'm trying to get warranty on.

Pete
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Oz1200Guzzi
Don Abbondio
Don Abbondio


Posts : 1783
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Age : 62

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Wed Nov 25, 2015 10:33 pm

Just kicking the bucket here - is this a call for a class action?
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Pete Roper
GRiSO
GRiSO


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Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 4:16 am

They tried something similar in the UK I believe. They went after the importer there and lost because the importer's argument was that they didn't technically sell motorbikes, they just facilitated their distribution or some such nonsense.

The thing is it really isn't the importer's fault any more than it is mine. This is down to bean counters in Noale and to take them on you'd have to take on Piaggio Corporate in Italy and I think they would have very deep pockets!

Look, I think the whole business stinks like a bucket of prawn heads on a hot day but I really can't see any lawsuit getting anywhere.

Pete
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John Lyon
Tanabuso
Tanabuso


Posts : 50
Join date : 2014-02-01

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 7:38 am

Pete Roper wrote:
They tried something similar in the UK I believe. They went after the importer there and lost because the importer's argument was that they didn't technically sell motorbikes, they just facilitated their distribution or some such nonsense.

The thing is it really isn't the importer's fault any more than it is mine. This is down to bean counters in Noale and to take them on you'd have to take on Piaggio Corporate in Italy and I think they would have very deep pockets.

I can see making such an argument for the importer, but Piaggio Corporate (or MG Corporate) issues the warranty and makes decisions regarding claims, as well as recalls.  This would seem to place responsibility there. I wonder how many 8V engines are at issue and what their total cost to fix would be?
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little750
Grignapoco
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Posts : 194
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Age : 61

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:38 am

Looks like all flat tappet 8 valvers and it would cost a lot.
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Cereal KLR
Carlotto
Carlotto


Posts : 39
Join date : 2015-10-12

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:49 am

These kinds of deals aren`t helping me steer clear lol.

3700 mile Stelvio for 7 grand...

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Hmmm, warranty available....ding!
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Pete Roper
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GRiSO


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Age : 59

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:54 am

Amazing how many of these PCV/AT equiped bikes keep turning up for sale in the classifieds, especially in So-Cal. I can't for the life of me imagine why???
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klaas123
Grignapoco
Grignapoco


Posts : 104
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Age : 56

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:55 am

Forcing us to buy expensive roller kits costs a lot too, goodwill to name one..

They could at least offer the kit for a reduced price.
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klaas123
Grignapoco
Grignapoco


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Age : 56

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:01 am

Pete Roper wrote:
Amazing how many of these PCV/AT equiped bikes keep turning up for sale in the classifieds, especially in So-Cal. I can't for the life of me imagine why???

Me neither, the PCV can't be the cause I think
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Cereal KLR
Carlotto
Carlotto


Posts : 39
Join date : 2015-10-12

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:18 am

Quick! Someone run the VIN to see if its been rollered then I can run down and buy it!
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Cereal KLR
Carlotto
Carlotto


Posts : 39
Join date : 2015-10-12

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:18 am

Quick! Someone run the VIN to see if its been rollered then I can run down and buy it!
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John Lyon
Tanabuso
Tanabuso


Posts : 50
Join date : 2014-02-01

PostSubject: Re: Another oncoming tappet failure?   Thu Nov 26, 2015 1:49 pm

Cereal KLR wrote:
These kinds of deals aren`t helping me steer clear lol.

3700 mile Stelvio for 7 grand...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]


Hmmm, warranty available....ding!

Nice looking bike.  Wonder how it runs.  Also odd to see "4V" on the side panel, when my 2010 GRiSO says "8V" with presumably the same engine.
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