12425 - Established June, 2013 - all GRiSO, all the time...
 
HomeRegisterLog in
Share
 

 Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?

Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2
AuthorMessage
2highlander
Biondino
Biondino
2highlander

Posts : 230
Join date : 2016-09-28
Age : 59

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Jan 24, 2017 4:31 am

Hi beetle,

already heard much of You as a Grio mapping guru, all meant positive. I also had a glimpse to your webiste, but found no appropriate map for the BOS double gun ...?
Back to top Go down
Pete Roper
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
Pete Roper

Posts : 6526
Join date : 2013-05-29
Age : 62

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Jan 24, 2017 7:40 am

You don't want to turn the Lambda back on, all you'll achieve is the ECU trying to trim the fuel back to its original horrid state when operating in closed loop.

The 8V is a strange beast. You have to look at it holistically to get the best out of it. The old maxims of 'Open it up and throw fuel at it' won't work.

Pete
Back to top Go down
2highlander
Biondino
Biondino
2highlander

Posts : 230
Join date : 2016-09-28
Age : 59

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Jan 24, 2017 10:00 am

Hi Pete,

not sure if I`m right with the follwing:

I could imagine that mapping and sensor are a well tuned team. Simply said, the lambda sensor is measuring a certain value and adapts it to the mapping accordingly.

Therefore, I think a decent mapping does not only spit around with lots of fuel. The skill of an an experienced mapping is to provide the right amount of fuel at certain revolutions and loading conditions. Beetle knows that fur sure  Cool . Roland also has been elaborating this in endless dyno tests. He definitely would not provide a mapping which is not perfect.

So far, I´m fully satiesfied with his mapping and how the engine works. No more jerky behaviour at constant low speed, fine acceleration when pulling the cable, what more do I want.

But let me experiment with the stock airbox with/-out snorkel pulled and lambda on/off. The statements here really made me curious how the engine`s output behaves.

Besides this, I`m not interested on max. horsepower output, my focus lies on high torque over a wide speed range. Or in other words, punch@lowspeed .... cyclops
Back to top Go down
beetle
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
beetle

Posts : 6855
Join date : 2013-09-30

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Jan 24, 2017 11:30 am

2highlander wrote:

already heard much of You as a Grio mapping guru, all meant positive. I also had a glimpse to your webiste, but found no appropriate map for the BOS double gun ...?


I don't have access to a BOS exhaust, and therefore can't build a map for same.

I would not recommend modifying the intake without modifying the map. Any changes you make will affect how the engine runs, as Roland would have (hopefully) modified the map specifically for the open air box. Also, switching lambda on will be detrimental, as it serves no purpose other than to meet emissions requirements. It is not for performance.

If you are happy with how the bike runs, don't change anything!



Thumbs Up
Back to top Go down
https://www.griso.org
jonnymac
Montanarolo
Montanarolo
jonnymac

Posts : 23
Join date : 2016-11-03

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:19 am

Sorry to interject here guys.
I have a brand new 2016 GRiSO. I bought a Termignoni pipe and fitted. W/o db killers it ran like shit (as expected from reading numerous posts). With the db killer in it ran much better (again as expected)
Now from this thread, can I assume that removing the snorkel will improve the breathing without affecting midrange performance and this can be done without a remap?
I am just trying to get it into the best all-round shape without making huge changes.
Back to top Go down
ghezzi
Fra Cristoforo
Fra Cristoforo
ghezzi

Posts : 2817
Join date : 2014-05-22
Age : 62

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:03 am

You'll still need a bottle of snake beetle oil.
Back to top Go down
http://www.biketowbrisbane.com.au
2highlander
Biondino
Biondino
2highlander

Posts : 230
Join date : 2016-09-28
Age : 59

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:42 am

Hmmm, pulling the snorkel really is no effort. Simply remove it and try. Tip, heating it up a bit will help.


Last edited by 2highlander on Thu Jan 26, 2017 2:22 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
Pete Roper
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
Pete Roper

Posts : 6526
Join date : 2013-05-29
Age : 62

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:48 am

jonnymac wrote:
Sorry to interject here guys.
I have a brand new 2016 GRiSO. I bought a Termignoni pipe and fitted. W/o db killers it ran like shit (as expected from reading numerous posts). With the db killer in it ran much better (again as expected)
Now from this thread, can I assume that removing the snorkel will improve the breathing without affecting midrange performance and this can be done without a remap?
I am just trying to get it into the best all-round shape without making huge changes.

'Huge Changes' are completely un-neccessary, really. A lot of money is wasted by people on crap that in many cases is actually counter productive. Without slipping a new map into it you won't achieve much by removing the snorkel if by 'Midrange' you mean that 3,500-5,000 rpm area, especially at less than wide throttle openings because in closed loop the ECU will still be trimming the fuel lean in most of that area and that 1,500-ish area is where the VE is worst and, with most pipes, the charge transition issue seems to be greatest.

Remove snorkel, buy cables and download Guzzidiag, slip in Beetlemap after making sure the tune is correct, ride. Very simple, very cheap, very effective.

Pete
Back to top Go down
moby
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
moby

Posts : 139
Join date : 2016-06-09
Age : 66

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:23 am

Pete Roper wrote:
jonnymac wrote:
Sorry to interject here guys.
I have a brand new 2016 GRiSO. I bought a Termignoni pipe and fitted. W/o db killers it ran like shit (as expected from reading numerous posts). With the db killer in it ran much better (again as expected)
Now from this thread, can I assume that removing the snorkel will improve the breathing without affecting midrange performance and this can be done without a remap?
I am just trying to get it into the best all-round shape without making huge changes.

'Huge Changes' are completely un-neccessary, really. A lot of money is wasted by people on crap that in many cases is actually counter productive. Without slipping a new map into it you won't achieve much by removing the snorkel if by 'Midrange' you mean that 3,500-5,000 rpm area, especially at less than wide throttle openings because in closed loop the ECU will still be trimming the fuel lean in most of that area and that 1,500-ish area is where the VE is worst and, with most pipes, the charge transition issue seems to be greatest.

Remove snorkel, buy cables and download Guzzidiag, slip in Beetlemap after making sure the tune is correct, ride. Very simple, very cheap, very effective.

Pete


Hi , just to add to the discussion. I've recently had my 1200 SE 2012 GRiSO rollerised after it ingested a bucketful of tappet.

I had a beetlemap (designed for the termigoni , baffles in - of course) installed at the same time by Mr Roper which included snorkel removal. I've since then done a fast 300 Kilometre haul in 39 degrees Celsius with 70kg luggage, city crawling in hot and cool conditions, and quick city night rides. It's the bike it should have been from the factory. It runs quieter, cooler. more torque from lowdown to everywhere, has linear power which is much stronger mid-range, is so much more predictable when you ride in a way that requires nuanced power delivery to let you know just exactly where, on a snapped- open throttle anywhere in the rev range, the bike is going to be in the next 2 or 3 seconds (city/suburban environment requires this).  I might have posted similar before but it reminds me of my Le Mans MkII in 1983 which ran so sweetly with accelerator pump Dellortos, when it hit higher end of tacho. Getting this experience just about everywhere now on the GRiSO, proves there is indeed progress.


Back to top Go down
jonnymac
Montanarolo
Montanarolo
jonnymac

Posts : 23
Join date : 2016-11-03

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Jan 26, 2017 10:00 am

OK, sounds good. I suppose I will need steering in the direction of where to get all of this. I found these [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Is that what is needed? I will also need pointers on the Guzzidiag front and information on how to obtain this 'ere Beetlemap.
I think I can handle removing the snorkel though
Back to top Go down
Pete Roper
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
Pete Roper

Posts : 6526
Join date : 2013-05-29
Age : 62

Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?   Improving exhaust note by opening up air box? - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Jan 26, 2017 11:18 am

Mark has written a comprehensive thread on Guzzidiag here

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Read, study and inwardly digest then ask questions as required.

For maps? Just click on the link in Mark's sig at the bottom of one of his posts. GRiSO.org or whatever. It'll link you to his site.

Pete
Back to top Go down
 
Improving exhaust note by opening up air box?
Back to top 
Page 2 of 2Go to page : Previous  1, 2

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
GRiSO ghetto :: The Ghetto :: GRiSO Inspiration-
Jump to: