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 Fuels with Ethanol

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zebraranger
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PostSubject: Fuels with Ethanol   Thu Mar 16, 2017 7:21 pm

Anyone have any issues running fuel with up to 10% ethanol blend? Around where I live, its almost impossible to find ethanol free fuel. I know what ethanol does to fuel lines, seals and such, but I was curious if that was and still is the problem with the fuel tanks on some of the GRiSO's and other Guzzi models.
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ghezzi
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PostSubject: Re: Fuels with Ethanol   Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:45 pm

Another forum I saw an article where I guy added water to his fuel.

Theory is, using a large funnel shaped container with a drain from its lowest point.
Channeled off into a large glass container.

The water and ethanol would combine together, and water being heavier than fuel it falls to the bottom. Stir it up, let it settle overnight then drain off the water.

When it is evident that fuel is coming down the hose, stop.
Then put the hose in your tank.

He was doing this for a carbureted bike and having no issues.
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Fuels with Ethanol   Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:10 pm

So far I haven't experienced an issue with 3 Grisos.
Be careful though...87 octane ethanol free is not good enough especially for the 8V engine due to the higher compression ratio.
So use 93 with the 10% crap in it if you can't find at least 89 ethanol free...
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LBC Tenni
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PostSubject: Re: Fuels with Ethanol   Sat Mar 18, 2017 2:28 pm

The key is ride frequently when using ethanol tainted fuel. It's when it sits there for days phase separating that it starts to soak into the nylon tank material. High humidity accelerates the problem.
I considered trying the "ethanol washing" method to remove it as Ghezzi mentions above. The problem is removing the ethanol results in fuel with significantly lower octane. So you then have to buy and add an octane booster. Guess what octane boosters are made of? 95% or more alcohol! So unless you have access to affordable ethanol free fuel at the pump, you're pretty much stuck with the ethanol crap. Thank your crooked politicians and huge ag companies like Monsanto for this debacle.
There are also two fuel stabilizing additives that do not contain alcohol and do prevent phase separation. I use Strartron when it's rainy out or the humidity gets high. The other is Sta-bil. Avoid the rest because they contain alcohol:

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The Norge tank seems to have a bigger problem with ethanol than the GRiSO. My Norge is currently at the dealer waiting for it's third tank. But I haven't owned it long and the PO let it sit around too much, so I'm hoping it won't be a problem again with more riding and using Startron additive. Time will tell. I've been researching coatings like Caswell epoxy, but it seems long term adhesion to nylon is not reliable for any of them.
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Charlie7
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PostSubject: Re: Fuels with Ethanol   Sat Mar 18, 2017 2:30 pm

ghezzi wrote:
Another forum I saw an article where I guy added water to his fuel.

Theory is, using a large funnel shaped container with a drain from its lowest point.
Channeled off into a large glass container.

The water and ethanol would combine together, and water being heavier than fuel it falls to the bottom. Stir it up, let it settle overnight then drain off the water.

When it is evident that fuel is coming down the hose, stop.
Then put the hose in your tank.

He was doing this for a carbureted bike and having no issues.

I work as an environmental manager for a petroleum company. Part of my job is dealing with water contaminated ethanol-blended gasoline. While the above process will work as described, part of the result of inducing phase separation is that the gasoline's octane is lowered. In addition when the alcohol combines with the water during phase separation and settles to the bottom this mixture is often flammable and is handled as a waste. I wonder how he is getting rid of the "water"?
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guzziownr
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PostSubject: Re: Fuels with Ethanol   Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:04 am

On my '09 the bubbling on the tank was horrible and it was replaced under warranty only to bubble again, less dramatically.

My 2013 has been much better. No bubbling, just a little shape distortion that made it hard to remove and reseat the tank. All the gas around here is ethanol. I use the highest premium I can find, 93-94.

On my V11 Sport the combination of a stupidly placed anti-spill valve and a plastic tank caused huge tank suck issues. After one long ride the sides of the tank popped out an inch or so when I flipped open the gas cap. The same valve on the GRiSO is firmly (and correctly) attached on the right hand side by the rider's knee.
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JohnA
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PostSubject: Re: Fuels with Ethanol   Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:46 pm

I own a 2014 GRiSO and lived in Houston area and could only find 10% ethanol fuel. I always used 93 octane. I travel with my job and have always been just a weekend rider but pretty religiously about every weekend since the weather never gets too cold. After the first year, the stripes on my tank started bubbling on the left side. I replaced them twice and then it started getting worse. My tank was obviously expanding and it was getting more visual. I found a used 2013 tank on line from a wrecked bike. I lined that tank with the epoxy for motorcycle tanks - Caswell. I swapped the tanks and no problems for several months. I've since moved to GA coast where I can buy "marine gas" 89 octane -non ethanol. The inside of my epoxy lined tank still looks great and there are many videos on line that show you people using the Caswell process. I would be glad to speak to you about it if you every considered it. If I had it to do over, I would have lined my original tank.
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