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 I'm on the road and I need help

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Omnis
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PostSubject: I'm on the road and I need help   Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:17 pm

2012 GRiSO decided to spew out what looks like oil or oil vapor on the left hand side under the TB and over the left side of gear box and smeared it over the brake reservoir and all over my left boot. It looks like a hose got detached from some drains.
Checked the gear box filler and drain all good and tight, sump drain good and dry.
Took some pics : [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Bike is running fine, just completed 560kms. Any thoughts as to what pipe my gut have gotten detached or where to look for possible cause?
Many thanks
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kiwi dave
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:02 pm

The brake reservoir is on the right hand side on my GRiSO. Seems strange that it got smeared on your bike and your left boot.
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:05 pm

Airbox blow-by pipe, or drain pipe?


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Bill Hagan
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 1:10 am

Where are you now?

Still riding?

Destination?

Bill

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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 3:34 am

Sorry I did mean right side right boot. I was a bit tired last night when I wrote the message.
Will check it out at first light this morning
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 4:19 am

Ah! The *Other* left.... Very Happy

As mentioned it's probably a cracked breather hose. If not it may be the rubber condom used to seal the *Extra* port on the condensor box in the breather system which sits up by the steering head, (Part 17 in the diagram.). This port is a hangover from the Bellagio which uses the same component basically and it's where the breather from the Bellagio's timing chest comes in. Because it's redundant on the G8 they put this condom on but, in typical Guzzi fashion, the material of the condom isn't particularly resistant to oil, (Great for a breather system, Eh?!) so they go all soft and flobbery and eventually split. Normal "Spoiling the ship for a ha'porth of tar" BS that Piaggio excells at.

It may be something else but I doubt it. How to fix it on a trip? Try buying some heat shrink and puting it over the split part. Will it work? Buggered if I know but it's worth a try!

Pete

PS. Nah. The condom is on the *real* left....Sorreeeee! Very Happy
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odder
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 9:40 am

FWIW, popped the condom and oil ended up on the right side. But... it was on mostly near the oil cooler. A little oil can look like a big mess when warm and wind.
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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 3:15 pm

Managed to hobble home with little damage as far as I can see other than right boot and right pants leg totally soaked. Tomorrow full day in the garage chasing condoms and other obscure gremlins.
Thanks for the help, glad I'm a ghetto denizen !
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Steak
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 6:04 pm

The common refrain from Dave at Moto International in Seattle is, "it looks like your left boot oiler has failed..."

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2012 MOTO GUZZI GRiSO 1200SE

2013 MOTO GUZZI STELVIO 1200NTX - Orange Blossom Special
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sideshowbob
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sat Oct 07, 2017 6:15 pm

Never met him, but I like Dave.
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GRD
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 2:46 am

It appears I have a similar issue after coming back from a ride yesterday, not as bad though.
There was a line of oil running down the right  hand side by the rear brake fluid line.

Hard to tell where it's coming from.  The bottom of the air box is coated with a light film of oil.
It looks to be either from the drain at the bottom of the air box, although the conection looks OK.  I did manage to push the tube a bit further up the nipple , just in case.

There doesn't appear to be any oil around the tube from the seperator,[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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higher up in the air box.

The other area the oil apears to be coming from is the the right hand throttle body conector tube. There is a film of oil higher up around the throttle body conector tube.
I've cleaned every thing up and will check next time I'm out for a ride.

If this is the case is it possible to remove and re-seal the throttle body conector tubes without removing the tank and air box.
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:38 am

Year? Model? If 8V, is it rollerised? C'mon! Help us here....

Pete
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GRD
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 4:59 am

Sorry, didn't realize your crystal ball was on the blink.

2012, GRiSO 8V, made in May, so I'm guessing it just missed out on rollers.
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 5:21 am

Have a look and see.

If the engine has flat tappets and they have gone seriously west it greatly diminishes the valve duration. If that happens the engine pumps less air but the ECU doesn't know that so it keeps on pumping in the same amount of fuel. This in turn results in a super rich mixture and bore wash which then promotes blow-by and the filling of the sump and emulsification of the oil with fuel. This amalgam cannot lubricate properly and neither can it seal rings. The end result I'd massive engine wear and large amounts of *Liquid* in the air box.

Have you un-plugged the air box drain? If so what came out? A small amount of oil or a lot of fuelly smelling liquid that was once oil! If the latter you're in big trouble.

Pete
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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 5:31 am

Ditto ! My 2012 8V Tenni Rollerized in normal riding exhibits the same oily film around the bottom of the air box. I wipe it clean every so often and ignore it. Now that I will have to investigate various drain hoses and split condoms I may consider a more radical fix to the seepage. I’m pissed off as the weather is still very good here in Ontario and forecasted to be decent for a bit longer, oh well I’ll be taking Nana Betty out instead (1975 750S3).
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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 5:39 am

Air box drain coughs one or two drops of fairly dense oil. That’s good, I think.
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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:56 am

I think I may have found some pipe connected incorrectly, namely the left hand fuel tank breather pipe is connected to the gearbox breather nipple. According to the book it should e connected to the right hand fuel tank breather and vented outside ...ehm the cannister.

But what does the gear box vent attach to? anybody knows? I cannot find reference to it in the parts or reference manual
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kiwi dave
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 12:24 pm

Omnis wrote:
But what does the gear box vent attach to? anybody knows? I cannot find reference to it in the parts or reference manual

Nothing. It vents to the atmosphere under the tank.
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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 12:27 pm

Perfect thanks
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GRD
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:59 pm

Pete Roper wrote:
Have a look and see.

If the engine has flat tappets and they have gone seriously west it greatly diminishes the valve duration. If that happens the engine pumps less air but the ECU doesn't know that so it keeps on pumping in the same amount of fuel. This in turn results in a super rich mixture and bore wash which then promotes blow-by and the filling of the sump and emulsification of the oil with fuel. This amalgam cannot lubricate properly and neither can it seal rings. The end result I'd massive engine wear and large amounts of *Liquid* in the air box.

Have you un-plugged the air box drain? If so what came out? A small amount of oil or a lot of fuelly smelling liquid that was once oil! If the latter you're in big trouble.

Pete

I've unplugged the air box drain. Only a very small amount of oil came out.
The bike has just 12,000 km on the clock and last serviced at the only Guzzi dealer in town a couple of months ago at 10,000 km
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Sun Oct 08, 2017 7:34 pm

If it's only got 12,000 on it it probably won't of had time to go tits yet if it is a flattie. Whip a rocker cover off and have a look or post a pic up so we can jeer or cheer!

Just remember that to get the plug cap off you DON'T tug away at it from the top. You use a long, thin screwdriver through the cooling tunnel in the head above the exhaust manifold and lever it off the plug from the bottom. If you yank away at the top it will tear and the spark will start jumping to earth causing you all sorts of grief!

Pete
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Omnis
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:22 am

On the road issue SORTED !!

I feel like a doorknob !! There I was looking for obscure reasons for the oil spill, deep seated condoms and other gremlins and the issue was always staring me in the face: the stupid little rubber bung that sealed the T bar from the right hand fuel tank vent split and wasn't sealing shit but spewing all over the place. Further the left hand fuel tank vent was incorrectly connected to the gear box vent.


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Reconnected and fixed properly now it' all good.

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Sometime its the little obvious shit that causes all the problems while you go looking for monsters.
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GRD
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:44 pm

Good to see you got that sorted.

After a cleanup and a 250 km ride it appears I may have made some incorrect assumptions.
When I got back from the ride I had some small spots down the right hand side where I previously had a couple of runs and thought it was oil because the bottom of the air box had a covering of oil mist and a drop of oil still hanging on to the air box.

I now think the liquid may have been brake fluid.  The reservoir cap was a bit loose.

There appears to be a bit of oil mist creeping out of the point where the throttle body connecting tube meets the airbox.
I'll need to keep an eye on this to verify.

If that's all it is I can live with having to give it a clean every now and then.[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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GRD
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:13 pm

Pete Roper wrote:
If it's only got 12,000 on it it probably won't of had time to go tits yet if it is a flattie. Whip a rocker cover off and have a look or post a pic up so we can jeer or cheer!

Just remember that to get the plug cap off you DON'T tug away at it from the top. You use a long, thin screwdriver through the cooling tunnel in the head above the exhaust manifold and lever it off the plug from the bottom. If you yank away at the top it will tear and the spark will start jumping to earth causing you all sorts of grief!

Pete

I guess I've got a flattie.

The heads have the drill mark and the rockercovers have short tubes?
Do the drill marks mean that shims will not be required?
Does this make labour on rollerizing cheaper?
Which kit would this bike need?

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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: I'm on the road and I need help   Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:21 pm

Thou shalt require an 'A' kit which doesn't require the heads to come off.

Pete

PS, I have just sold my stock 'A' kit to Wardest but I have another on order, it should be here in a few weeks.

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