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Robinson_Spike
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PostSubject: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Mon 27 Nov 2017 - 16:18




Hello again folks,

Well 500miles in from buying into the Guzzi life I’m still struggling to get my head around this 2013 8V GRiSO engine number 13859 that has 10000 miles on it.

Just what should it sound like, I’ve no one local that I trust for an opinion perhaps you guys can recommend a friendly ear here in Northern England. To me it sounds like a 5 cylinder VW diesel but I’m not convinced that’s good for the GRiSO. The sound seems to be lower down than the valve train, valve clearances are good and / but there’s 0.25mm end float in the rocker shafts. The motor has Motul 10w60 in it.

The noise only seems to be there around idle, it’s not something like piston slap on these motors is it? Timing chain?

What do you reckon? :[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
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motor-timothy
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Mon 27 Nov 2017 - 16:30

Mine has this as well, just a little bit less loud. Does the sound go away when you pull the clutch handle? If so I've been told on this forum that its backlash from the gears and nothing to worry about.
I've learned after a while that with this bike *most* of the weird sounds that can come out of the engine are quite normal
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Mon 27 Nov 2017 - 17:38

It's so hard to tell from this sort of video as the quality of the microphone and speaker it's coming from on my pad of eyes! Certainly there is the usual roller tappet noise, whether there is anything else it's hard to say.

If it sounds cam chainy though it may be the result of the sump spacer gasket having blown out. Certainly if you're worried that's what I'd check first. This is the one between the spacer and the block not the one between the sump and the spacer. There was an update for the gasket to a better material.

Pete
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Mon 27 Nov 2017 - 18:37

I was gonna say the same thing than Pete.
I recently traded my 2013 for a new one and I went through that ordeal last summer...
That gasket is cheap material.
Does the noise remain constant or is it only when the engine is hot?
If so, it's most likely that stupid gasket...
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Robinson_Spike
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Tue 28 Nov 2017 - 2:46

Grisonut wrote:
I was gonna say the same thing than Pete.
I recently traded my 2013 for a new one and I went through that ordeal last summer...
That gasket is cheap material.
Does the noise remain constant or is it only when the engine is hot?
If so, it's most likely that stupid gasket...

Thanks again folks - it’s not what I’d instantly identify as a chain sound but the noise is equal both sides of the motor, seemingly from the rear of the cylinders and is there from cold through to hot without change. You almost forget about it out on the road until you coast to a standstill at traffic lights.

So there’s a chance that it’s a lack of chain pressure caused by losing some oil across a gallery due to a failed gasket?

I’m pretty good but I’d rather see what’s coming before having a lie down on the floor - can anyon point me to a pdf of a manual please?

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sidrat
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Tue 28 Nov 2017 - 3:42

Send a PM to PaulBrice he lives somewhere near you
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paulbrice
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Tue 28 Nov 2017 - 5:30

I'd be more than happy to ride over and let you hear how (noisy) mine sounds (just send me a Forum Message) - as Pete says it's hard to tell from recordings how the software/hardware filtered or changed mix of pitches BUT first pass I'd say it doesn't sound like anything wrong to me despite I don't spend much time listening to it without earplugs in Wink

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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Tue 28 Nov 2017 - 21:33

Robinson_Spike wrote:
Grisonut wrote:
I was gonna say the same thing than Pete.
I recently traded my 2013 for a new one and I went through that ordeal last summer...
That gasket is cheap material.
Does the noise remain constant or is it only when the engine is hot?
If so, it's most likely that stupid gasket...

Thanks again folks - it’s not what I’d instantly identify as a chain sound but the noise is equal both sides of the motor, seemingly from the rear of the cylinders and is there from cold through to hot without change. You almost forget about it out on the road until you coast to a standstill at traffic lights.

So there’s a chance that it’s a lack of chain pressure caused by losing some oil across a gallery due to a failed gasket?

I’m pretty good but I’d rather see what’s coming before having a lie down on the floor - can anyon point me to a pdf of a manual please?


When mine did it, it sounded like a piston pin knock and I knew it wasn't that but I parked the bike anyhow until I figured it out.
Oh, and the oil light was flicking at times...
Hopefully Paulbrice will figure it out for you.
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MotoMT
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Tue 28 Nov 2017 - 23:04

My first thought was, "Hey, that sounds like my bike." I had similar worries when I first got my 2015 until another Guzzi rider at a bike meet assured me that everything sounded just fine. I'm no expert, though, and maybe that guy wasn't either.  Razz  But, I've come to appreciate the interesting mechanical "flavor" to the engine sound.

Please give an update to what you finally figure out. I'm always curious to learn of other riders' similar experiences. Plus ... there's always that paranoid, nagging idiot speaking to me in my head, telling me that "I don't know nothin' and my GRiSO sounds weird."
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zebraranger
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Tue 28 Nov 2017 - 23:36

My 2016 sounds similar, but not at startup when the motor is cold. Once warmed up thou, lots of clatter, just like an old diesel tractor.
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sidrat
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 3:28

zebraranger wrote:
just like an old diesel tractor.

I thought mine WAS an old diesel tractor!
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Bulldog9
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 9:46

Ah Guzzi and Noises.......... I remember the first time I rode my GRiSO (2007 4V) Swung a leg over, pulled in the clutch and released it in horror at the shredding grinding of the throwout bearing..... Quiet unengaged, but when engaged makes a terrible sound. Dave at MI chucked and assured me it was normal and then gave me a lesson on Guzzi and Noise. Basically, if it sounds bad it is normal ;-)

It was hard for me to adjust to the clackety racket of my Norge engine (2014 8V) compared to the GRiSO, but have learned that it too is normal. Of course the Norge clutch is a complete 180 to the GRiSO, unengaged it clacks and rattles, engaged and it is quiet....

As for the motors, the 4V is buttery smooth in comparison to the diesel clack and clatter of the 8V.... It is disconcerting, but totally normal. I've thought about playing with the tolerances a bit to see if it can cut down the noise to sewing machine level. I run swivel foot adjusters with zero lash on my pushrod type IV/Porsche hotrod motor, and have wondered if I could try the same on the Guzzi 8V.
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paulbrice
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 10:09

I can confirm it sounds (and looks) even more lovely in the flesh Wink . Side by side it didn't sound any different (ie equally as bad) to mine and especially with earplugs I get rattles and resonances all through the driving range. There aren't any faults in the logs indicating oil pressure or any other issue based on guzzidiag and laptop in the ffffffreezing cold car park of Krispy Creme donut factory ! I thinks it's good-to-go
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sidrat
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 10:17

Well done Paul!
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Robinson_Spike
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 10:49

Well that’s a wrap then, I can stop worrying about nothing and continue to enjoy the organic experience that is GRiSO riding.

Thanks to every one for their input, especially P Brice for going above and beyond!

See (some of) you on the road
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 13:57

Bulldog9 wrote:
Ah Guzzi and Noises.......... I remember the first time I rode my GRiSO (2007 4V) Swung a leg over, pulled in the clutch and released it in horror at the shredding grinding of the throwout bearing..... Quiet unengaged, but when engaged makes a terrible sound. Dave at MI chucked and assured me it was normal and then gave me a lesson on Guzzi and Noise.  Basically, if it sounds bad it is normal ;-)

It was hard for me to adjust to the clackety racket of my Norge engine (2014 8V) compared to the GRiSO, but have learned that it too is normal. Of course the Norge clutch is a complete 180 to the GRiSO, unengaged it clacks and rattles, engaged and it is quiet....

As for the motors, the 4V is buttery smooth in comparison to the diesel clack and clatter of the 8V.... It is disconcerting, but totally normal. I've thought about playing with the tolerances a bit to see if it can cut down the noise to sewing machine level. I run swivel foot adjusters with zero lash on my pushrod type IV/Porsche hotrod motor, and have wondered if I could try the same on the Guzzi 8V.

Errr. Only the throw out bearing is silent. The high pitched 'Chinky-Chinky' noise with the clutch engaged on the 1100 is the intermediate plate of the twin plate clutch rattling in the flywheel splines as the flywheel accelerates and decelerates with the power and compression strokes of the engine. It's the sound of the flywheel ringing like a bell with the intermediate plate being its clapper.

Pete
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 19:10

Pete, do you think it could be possible to retro fit a late model 8V clutch on the 1100?
Would that involve swapping to a 8V flywheel as well?
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 21:10

Not possible as the gearbox input systems are different. Really though the twin plater is time proven and generally robust. Don't frett about the racket but make sure the TB's Re balanced and don't sit at the lights with the clutch pulled in
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Wed 29 Nov 2017 - 22:50

Thanks for the info. And I'm not worry about my bike, it doesn't have enough miles to need a clutch yet (29K miles).
It's been doing that noise since new and I know it's the nature of the beast anyway.
Some folks on the 1100 are getting high mileage by now so I was just curious to see if those guys could go with a different clutch system.

My 09 was a real bitch to activated the clutch...frankly, I couldn't see a woman operate that bike it was so hard to pull on the lever.
There's no way anyone would sit at a red light with the clutch engaged on this one...
Beside being a bad idea you would also indulge in self inflicted pain. lol
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motor-timothy
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Thu 30 Nov 2017 - 15:57

Grisonut wrote:
My 09 was a real bitch to activated the clutch...frankly, I couldn't see a woman operate that bike it was so hard to pull on the lever.
There's no way anyone would sit at a red light with the clutch engaged on this one...
Beside being a bad idea you would also indulge in self inflicted pain. lol

My 2009 has this. I've now gotten used to it, but the first few months I had a sore left hand from operating the clutch. I've always wondered if they designed the clutch this way to promote the 'bike for real men' image. I imagine all GRiSO owners eventually end up with this huge and muscular left hand after a couple of years of operating the clutch... elephant
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GHTE
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Thu 30 Nov 2017 - 20:34

Interesting, my 1100 clutch is not hard to activate at all. Just wondering if a good fluid purge would help?
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Thu 30 Nov 2017 - 20:46

motor-timothy wrote:
...I imagine all GRiSO owners eventually end up with this huge and muscular left hand after a couple of years of operating the clutch...

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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Thu 30 Nov 2017 - 21:35

motor-timothy wrote:
Grisonut wrote:
My 09 was a real bitch to activated the clutch...frankly, I couldn't see a woman operate that bike it was so hard to pull on the lever.
There's no way anyone would sit at a red light with the clutch engaged on this one...
Beside being a bad idea you would also indulge in self inflicted pain. lol

My 2009 has this. I've now gotten used to it, but the first few months I had a sore left hand from operating the clutch. I've always wondered if they designed the clutch this way to promote the 'bike for real men' image. I imagine all GRiSO owners eventually end up with this huge and muscular left hand after a couple of years of operating the clutch... elephant

I don't know exactly when they upgraded the clutch (2012?) plates but it was peachy on my 2013 and it sure is on the 2017.
Also light action on the 1100...
Just the early 8V were rough I guess.
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avgpetro
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Fri 1 Dec 2017 - 2:59

If you're right-handed, you have stronger grip at the right hand. Guzzi carres, making you have strong grip at both hands.

If you're left-handed... you should have no problem with the clutch :-D
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PostSubject: Re: Just how noisy should an 8V be..?   Fri 1 Dec 2017 - 15:01

Good point, I am decidedly left handed, hence no clutch pull effort on my 1100.
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