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12425 - Established June, 2013 - all GRiSO, all the time...
 
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 Part 2: The Reconstruction

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sideshowbob
paulbrice
GR1064
relayer
Grisonut
waterbottle
beetle
GHTE
Pete Roper
NorthernProducer
Street
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beetle
GRiSO Capo
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beetle


Posts : 9537
Join date : 2013-09-30

Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:35 pm

Was that with the ECU connected? Test again with it unplugged.
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GuZeee
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
GuZeee


Posts : 391
Join date : 2017-08-03

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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 12:28 am

beetle wrote:
Was that with the ECU connected? Test again with it unplugged.

ECU unplugged. Just testing the harness, between sensor connector and ECU connector.
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:34 am

That's not good. 20Ω is an interesting value. Not really a dead short. There's no crud in the connectors, by any chance?


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GuZeee
GRiSO Capo
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GuZeee


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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:35 am

Nope, connectors are clean.
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:11 am

While I'll leave the heavy diagnosis to people more qualified than me I would say that the old saw about 'Italian Electrics' no longer holds water. I've been working in Italian stuff since the seventies and Guzzi were always pretty good. Morini? Laverda? Awful!

Modern Guzzis? I've had two bad looms, both on Breva big blocks. Otherwise? Nothing......

Pete
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:04 am

I don't believe a loom can just "go bad". There must be unseen damage. Is the tank off? At this pont I'd be pulling the tank off and disconnecting the intake sensor as well. They have a common connection to pin 20. Recheck everything.



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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 12:00 pm

Yes tank is off, air temp sensor disconnected, harness is all visible and there is no obvious damage. I clipped off a few of the zip ties I put on, wondering if they were too tight. Observing the resistance while moving the harness showed no change.

One thing I am wondering is if the problem I had with the alternator shorting out could have burned something out? I know with fuses etc it should not not be possible for a wire to actually burn out due to over current, but it’s the only thing I can think of.

I think my next step will be to try to trace the point of failure in the temp sensor wire itself, and possible run a new one. Worst case, I end up needing to replace the harness. It will be a pain to do so with the engine and airbox in place though!

Any additional opinions on this as a next step? Also, is it possible to remove the entire airbox without dropping the engine?
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Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:10 pm

If it turns out that you have only one dud wire in the loom, why not run a new wire externally to the loom, and solder it in to the plugs at each end?


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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:32 pm

Airbox will just pop out, no need to do anything extreme.
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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 5:20 pm

OMG I'M SUCH AN IDIOT!!!!!!

This is too embarrassing to reveal, but since I've wasted everyone's time with this problem, I owe it to you all to suck it up and admit what a ridiculously bone-headed OBVIOUS mistake I made!

No, I can't say it, it's too stupid. I will only leave these clues:

1. The engine temperature sensor and fuel injector use the SAME connector type. (Temp sensor is color-coded, however, for people who have even minimal powers of observation.)

2. Fuel injector has a resistance of 15-20 ohms Laughing

3. Running without an injector connected tends to reduce power output somewhat.

4. Following bizarre and unlikely explanations for a problem before thinking of the obvious, likely ones is something to be ridiculed and mocked without mercy. Please, feel free Smile
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 5:34 pm

Oh ho!

You're brave to admit such a bone-headed mistake. I laughed out loud when I read your boo-boo.

Tee hee!

Cred for joining the complete knob club.


clown
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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Fri Dec 29, 2017 5:44 pm

beetle wrote:
Oh ho!
Cred for joining the complete knob club.

clown

Ooh, I should be earning lots of cred owning this bike, based on my performance so far Laughing
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paulbrice
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 7:40 am

I'm just relieved you didn't take the engine out & replace the wiring loom !....thanks for sharing the pain & the glory as it will help us all avoid the same 'simple mistakes'
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GHTE
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:39 am

Mate it would not have happened to me as I would not have had the balls to undertake what you have done. Clearly you have just attained a massive learning curve throughout the whole project and its a big credit to you. Now go ride the pants off her.
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sideshowbob
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:43 am

For me, the relief of finding the problem, outweighs the error, and I have made many.
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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:55 am

Thanks for the words of encouragement! It’s running great! There are still a couple of minor things to straighten out, but I’ve got my bike back again, looking better than ever.
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Street
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Street


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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:01 pm

Plus 1! I wouldn't have the balls or the wherewithal to undertake this job so you've definitely earned some Ghetto cred!


Last edited by Street on Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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GuZeee
GRiSO Capo
GRiSO Capo
GuZeee


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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:01 pm

Damn! I mentioned a couple of minor things to work out? Thanks to one of those “minor” things I am now stuck at a gas station with no way to ride home Sad

Minor thing #1 was just a burned out headlight bulb, which I replaced. Yay.

“Minor” thing #2 (quotes required this time) was that the clutch was feeling weird. I thought I just needed to bleed the hydraulics, since I had to disconnect and reconnect the line when I put the actuator back. But I added some fluid and pumped it a few times and it seemed to be working fine. So I went on a ride.

Stopped for gas and now I can’t release the clutch. The lever is solid and will not pull in. The clutch is not engaged, i.e. I can still roll the bike in first gear.

What could cause this? I have time to think about it while I either try to get a tow or push the bike 7 miles to home.
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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:11 pm

Could this be caused by adding too much brake fluid to the reservoir? Maybe it expanded with heat and now it’s activating the slave cylinder. Maybe I just need to bleed fluid some off?
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:05 pm

I'm not sure it would get hot enough to lock up in just 7 miles. scratch

Bleeding it is the first thing to try.



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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:07 pm

OK, thanks, I’ll try that when I get it back home. I was thinking of getting tools and doing it here it the gas station parking lot, but I’d rather be in my garage with everything I need, so I’m paying $135 for a ride on a flatbed. My wife STRONGLY discouraged the “push it home” idea Laughing
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:15 pm

I would have just cracked the bleeder with a rag under it. Isn't there a spanner (wrench) in the bikes toolkit?


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GuZeee
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GuZeee


Posts : 391
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:18 pm

Unfortunately no, I checked. I would need two wrenches to hold one side and turn the other. I need to add an adjustable wrench to the little toolkit under the seat! (It’s nice and easy to get to the bleeder on this bike.) But I already called for the flatbed Sad
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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 2:41 pm

Damn she looks fine on the back of the flatbed Smile

So bleeding the lines made it work again but I don’t trust it. Look at all the crud in the reservoir!!! Is that normal? I feel like I should clean it all out.

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GuZeee
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PostSubject: Re: Part 2: The Reconstruction   Part 2: The Reconstruction - Page 3 Icon_minitime1Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:57 pm

Removed the old fluid, cleaned out the reservoir, refilled and bled it through. Clutch is working great so far, just did a 10 mile fun ride and the clutch actually feels a lot better than it ever did. Go figure: there was crap clogging it up all along.

That ride was so much fun it reminded me why I don’t care how much time or money I spend on this thing, it’s all worth it Smile
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