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 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.

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2highlander
Biondino
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2highlander

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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 6:10 am

Butter by the fishes, I did the 1400 ccm setup with my GRiSO. 122 hp @ 6340 rpm and 142 NM @ 4020 rpm. It actually runs with the same Daes map as it did with 1200 ccm.

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Pete Roper
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 12:12 pm

Believe it if you wish.
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kiwi dave
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 1:17 pm

Pete Roper wrote:
Believe it if you wish.

Looks genuine to me, Pete. Are you doubting its authenticity?
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ghezzi
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 2:53 pm

I would hate to show that graph to my neighbour, he builds 1000HP plus engines.

1. HP is just a multiplication factor of torque, and both lines should cross over at 5,250rpm.
2. Running different numbers up each side of the page gives distorted curves, and how power and torque combine or work together.
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Pete Roper
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 3:30 pm

Look, I could write a very long and detailed post ‘splainin how the laws of physics and thermodynamics govern the amount of torque you can produce from a given design and then go on to expose why such absurd figures are unachievable with the Guzzi 8V motor.

I could, but it wouldn’t be worth it because people would still point to the charts and say “but, but, but...” because it’s what they want to believe and I’m sorry but I simply can’t be arsed. I don’t have enough life left to waste.
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sideshowbob
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 4:01 pm

Fudging dyno sheets is a cottage industry over here. Unless I'm sitting in the booth with a competent operator and watch him input all of the parameters, I'm not buying it. I have been showed how easy it is to get the results you want.
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Pete Roper
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 4:08 pm

Bernd sent me a chart the other day that claimed 140+hp. I said bollocks and he agreed. He also said that he thought that the hp figure, (From I believe the same dyno as the one above.) was ‘Corrected’ horsepower. Now I don’t know exactly what ‘Corrected’ means but I strongly suspect it means ‘Some numbers I pulled out of my arse’! Very Happy
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Pete Roper
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 4:30 pm

ghezzi wrote:
I would hate to show that graph to my neighbour, he builds 1000HP plus engines.

1. HP is just a multiplication factor of torque, and both lines should cross over at 5,250rpm.
2. Running different numbers up each side of the page gives distorted curves, and how power and torque combine or work together.

Shows how much attention I pay to such nonsense! Well spotted Wayne. More confirmation of farting unicorns.
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beetle
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 5:09 pm

kiwi dave wrote:

Looks genuine to me, Pete.  Are you doubting its authenticity?


So you believe everything that's on a chart?


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beetle
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 5:14 pm

What I'd like to see, is one of these 120+ HP monsters tested on an independent dyno.


Suspect


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Street
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 5:29 pm

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ghezzi
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 7:39 pm

Mark, don't lay the challenge for another dyno and bullshit piece of paper.

LET'S JUST RACE!
$1000 ENTRY FEE - WINNER TAKES ALL!

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odder
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 9:53 pm

IMHO, it’d probably take Tuono money to get the 8V anywhere near that number. Just buy the Tuono and enjoy two bikes!

The unicorn graph is choice!
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Pete Roper
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 11:52 pm

odder wrote:
IMHO, it’d probably take Tuono money to get the 8V anywhere near that number. Just buy the Tuono and enjoy two bikes!

The unicorn graph is choice!

It would take fundamental changes to the universal laws governing the cosmos to get 140hp out of this engine. Laughing

Pete
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2highlander
Biondino
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Fri May 11, 2018 11:54 pm

Pete, looking at the diagrams, I don't care about absolute numbers, let it be some percent higher or lower, I shit on this when looking at this level of output. Besides that I must point out that not horsepower, but NM at the lower end are important for me and how power is provided.

Whatever level this may be, the torque curve is a dream to surf on. The truth is that the bike makes me scream under my helmet now and believe me, I'm not easy to impress. I'm fully satisfied so far, I never rode such a strong GRiSO before. If You would like to get out more You will really have to look for another bike.

As far as I know You also did a 1400ccm conversion, didn't the power impress You?


Last edited by 2highlander on Sat May 12, 2018 12:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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Pete Roper
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sat May 12, 2018 12:03 am

As previously stated we expected, and got, a small increase in HP with a lower rev limit. What we also achieved was a substantial increase in torque with an almost dead flat torque curve from 2,000 to rev limiter. Basically what we expected and predicted. We just didn’t feel the need to talk smack about what is achievable.

I don’t doubt that with other substantial modifications a few more peak hp would be achievable but not a 50% increase over stock.

Pete
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2highlander
Biondino
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sat May 12, 2018 12:28 am

Sir Pete, You hit the point. This is exactly what I expected too and now has come true. 121 PS as a moderate rise of power and 142 NM as a substainly increase of torque somehow hit Your predictions. Isn't this fantastic to ride! It's so much more of fun, I did 1200 km of pure fun within a week!
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Grisonut
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sat May 12, 2018 6:16 am

You know, Carroll Shelby said that horsepower wins sales but torque wins races. Wink
Nothings changed...
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2highlander
Biondino
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sat May 12, 2018 10:40 am

Yep! Torque matters!
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ghezzi
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sat May 12, 2018 2:00 pm

Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall.
Torque is how far you move it.
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2highlander
Biondino
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sun May 13, 2018 12:24 am

*HarHar
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pauldaytona
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140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: 140 HP out of a Cali 1400.   140 HP out of a Cali 1400. - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Sat May 19, 2018 4:48 am

So here a slightly different one. For a German friend. He had a A5 roller engine bought a 100 mm bore cylinder/piston for it. Build it together in his Tonti special.  It has a 15Rc ecu without lambda. Idle valve is gone. Front engine cover is made that fits with a generator on the crank. Map was made by the Dynoshop who is his friend. The bike has loads of special parts all made by himself in the basement, no cnc, only conventional machining. Even silencers were self made.
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