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 Stepper motor acting up

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XU12
Dilliw
lcjohnny
Gootzibird13
BrianD
Evilgarfield
Oz1200Guzzi
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Evilgarfield
Grignapoco
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Evilgarfield


Posts : 173
Join date : 2021-03-24

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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:34 am

Small update on this. The manual valve was not a very elegant solution and a new stepper was too expensive, so I decided to come up with my own solution.

I bought a thermal switch triggering at 60°C (NC) and put it in series with a 12VDC solenoid valve mounted on the pipe between the air box and the stepper motor. The thermal switch will be glued with thermal epoxy between the fins of the left cylinder.

Here is a schematics of it:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I did quick proof of concept on the bike and it works well. I'm currently waiting for watertigh connectors and I have to determine exactly where I want to glue the switch on the cylinder so that the circuit is broken at the right engine temp.
I will post installation pictures as soon as I get the missing parts.
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Evilgarfield
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Mar 15, 2022 7:57 am

Btw could I completely remove the stepper and use the mounting holes to put the valve? Would that be a problem with the ECU?
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Mar 15, 2022 11:18 am

If you disconnect the stepper it will trigger a service warning on the dash.
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Dilliw
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Dilliw


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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:07 pm

Mine acts up in some pattern of randomness that I haven't quite figured out. Would relative humidity mess with it? It seems like it sometimes hangs up on the first pause (stop sign, etc) of the first ride of the day, and more so when there is morning fog or precipitation. The rest of the time it idles as it should to the point where I've never worried about messing with it.

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Oz1200Guzzi
Don Abbondio
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Oz1200Guzzi


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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:20 pm

They get intermittent as they age. I doubt if RH has anything to do with it, certainly being "cold" would affect it. It will get worse, George.

Living in Texas, you could probably block it off all together, without issues, apart from a low idle from first start. Mine has been disconnected for 7+ years and even starts in temps as low as 0C (32F for you) - it might need a touch of throttle for 10-20 seconds, that's all. If you do block it off, don't forget to block off the spigot under the airbox.
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Dilliw
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Mar 16, 2022 6:35 am

Oz1200Guzzi wrote:
They get intermittent as they age. I doubt if RH has anything to do with it, certainly being "cold" would affect it. It will get worse, George.

Living in Texas, you could probably block it off all together, without issues, apart from a low idle from first start. Mine has been disconnected for 7+ years and even starts in temps as low as 0C (32F for you) - it might need a touch of throttle for 10-20 seconds, that's all. If you do block it off, don't forget to block off the spigot under the airbox.

Thanks Don. I will try that route.
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XU12
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Mon Mar 21, 2022 10:52 pm

Hi, regarding the opening of the Steppermotor, i have done this . You can lift it after removing the clampspring, then you can unscrew the "Motorpart" from the Valvepart. I have posted this in the Guzzienduro.org - Forum. I didn't reinstall the Stepper, because have purchased a new one for a still horrible, but reduced price.
Greetings from Germany in Springtime!

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Rock80
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Tue Apr 05, 2022 12:51 pm

XU12 wrote:
Hi, regarding the opening of the Steppermotor, i have done this . You can lift it after removing the clampspring, then you can unscrew the "Motorpart" from the Valvepart. I have posted this in the Guzzienduro.org - Forum. I didn't reinstall the Stepper, because have purchased a new one for a still horrible, but reduced price.
Greetings from Germany in Springtime!
Hi XU12 !
I tried to connect to the Guzzienduro.org forum but topics cannot be accessed by guests Sad
Would you be kind enough to post it here too ?

I am facing some difficulties with my stepper motor that seem to "partially" work only (I can feel it "resetting" when switching off getting from open to fully closed and re-opening afterwwards when !I blow in the tube connected to airbox) but it seems to not open on cold start-ups resulting into very low rpm's till engine warms up a bit.
Reading the Base + Control + Break values of Stepper motor in Guzzidiag shows that ECU seem to ask for valve to open (Control value rises to 100) but Base value remains unchanged whereas, to what i found, it should rise up.
Therefore, I think it can close cheers  ...but it cannot open completely Embarassed despite my attempt to clean ith with carb cleaner sprayed from airbox tube No So, if it can be opened, I may then be able to clean also the normal to full opening range !
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BrianD
Don Abbondio
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Apr 06, 2022 4:18 am

I found that you can get a replacement motor assembly off fleabay for a reasonable price but I haven't successfully managed to get it to clamp in position in the aluminium body; there's a serrated washer around the motor assembly.

you also have to swap over the brass plunger assembly with the plastic bullet plunger.

I think I have seen a picture of a full plastic version of the stepper motor (can't remember where)

Gave up in the end
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Rock80
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Apr 06, 2022 5:24 am

Mine is a full plastic stepper "motor" if you are talking about the complete Idle Control device (My GRiSO is one of the last made in 2016).

In my case, the electrical motor seem to work but my assumption is that it can run from "default" semi-open position to fully close but it can fully open. So I am just wondering if the electrical motor can be removed to inspect what keeps the plunger from fully opening.
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Evilgarfield
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Apr 14, 2022 5:21 am

Evilgarfield wrote:
Small update on this. The manual valve was not a very elegant solution and a new stepper was too expensive, so I decided to come up with my own solution.

I bought a thermal switch triggering at 60°C (NC) and put it in series with a 12VDC solenoid valve mounted on the pipe between the air box and the stepper motor. The thermal switch will be glued with thermal epoxy between the fins of the left cylinder.

Here is a schematics of it:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I did quick proof of concept on the bike and it works well. I'm currently waiting for watertigh connectors and I have to determine exactly where I want to glue the switch on the cylinder so that the circuit is broken at the right engine temp.
I will post installation pictures as soon as I get the missing parts.

So I finally had time to implement my idea to replace the function of the kaputt stepper by a solenoid valve.

I started by epoxy the thermal switch on the wall of the cylinder
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I then fixed the solenoid valve with a bracket between the stepper and its mount and tucked the connectors next to it.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

And plugged the whole thing on a switched output of my eastern beaver harness so that it does not drain my battery when the bike is off.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I tested it yesterday and today and it works perfectly. I started the bike cold on a chilly morning (3°C) and it cranked up right away and settled at 1100RPM. I rode away and never had a high idle over the 2h ride. Today I repeated the test with 23°C and same again, no high idle when warm or rough when cold.  cheers

It might be overkill but at least it's working as it should and it costed me less than 20 bucks.

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BrianD
Don Abbondio
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Apr 14, 2022 8:34 am

Unless you use your bike in very low temps, less then -4 Celsius that I tend to experience I wouldn't worry about having the valve or stepper, I've not noticed any issues and you can always let the engine warm up for a bit longer should you wish. I think I must have had my stepper removed for the last 3 or 4 years and ride all year round.
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Evilgarfield
Grignapoco
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Evilgarfield


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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Apr 14, 2022 9:40 am

I have some very cold mornings but it was more about a quick fix to have a bike setting nicely to that 1100 RPM idle whatever the temperature than worrying about it.

Let's call it a quality of life change Smile
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KenGriso
Carlotto
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Join date : 2022-04-26

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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:32 pm

My idle was erratic so I plugged up the stepper motor and that solved it. Do I need to balance the throttle bodies and reset the TPS now?
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Oz1200Guzzi
Don Abbondio
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Aug 11, 2022 12:12 am

Should be good, just ride...

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paulbrice
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Aug 11, 2022 2:49 am

Personally I'd rebalance the air bypass and probably higher rev balance as well, because presumably you've closed off both air feeds from the stepper (or blocked feed to them)??.

I'm not sure why (& can't be bothered to find out), but my GRiSO won't idle with the stepper feed blocked & I think would then have to have more bypass air to get it back to stable idle.
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KenGriso
Carlotto
Carlotto
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Aug 11, 2022 6:48 am

paulbrice wrote:
Personally I'd rebalance the air bypass and probably higher rev balance as well, because presumably you've closed off both air feeds from the stepper (or blocked feed to them)??.

I'm not sure why (& can't be bothered to find out), but my GRiSO won't idle with the stepper feed blocked  & I think would then have to have more bypass air to get it back to stable idle.

I blocked the air feed to the stepper without rebalancing and it seems to idle and run nicely. I'll check the balance though for good measure.

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ZackC
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PostSubject: Re: Stepper motor acting up   Stepper motor acting up - Page 2 Icon_minitime1Thu Nov 09, 2023 5:23 pm

BrianD wrote:
Unless you use your bike in very low temps, less then -4 Celsius that I tend to experience I wouldn't worry about having the valve or stepper, I've not noticed any issues and you can always let the engine warm up for a bit longer should you wish. I think I must have had my stepper removed for the last 3 or 4 years and ride all year round.

Hey Brian,

What bike did you do this to? Did you do anything extra beyond plugging up holes and capping off ports?
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