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rick pope
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PostSubject: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:28 pm

Just getting my 8v back on the road - had a huge issue with front fork tube wear, resulting in a new oil field in my garage. It's a long, expensive story. But it's sorted.

However....

I bust the copper connector on the end of the negative earth strap some time ago, and bodged it by drilling the stump and attaching to the side of the battery post.

In the process of re-commissioning and refitting the battery, I managed to break the positive, too.

So, I thought I'd replace both leads. Checked Fowler's. HOW MUCH????? About 150 of your Earth GB Pounds is how much. Holy bebuggeration Batperson.

So for now I have bodged the positive too, in a similar way. It works. But I don't like it.

Can you crimp or solder new connectors onto these leads? I know that allegedly, size doesn't matter, but my crimping tool looks like a toy when you consider the girth of the thing. Anyone done it?
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:03 pm

bad things can happen if a battery cable comes lose and decides to flop around. especially when it's directly under your nuts!!
it's an easy fix with the right tool.
you should be able to get new terminals (cable ends, connector - whatever thy are called across the pond) at your local auto parts store and crimp them on.
you may get lucky and your local electrical supply house will have a loaner tool. otherwise, most electricians will have a tool or know where you can get one.

you can also solder a new one on if you are careful. make sure everything is extra clean, pre-tin the wire and use flux on the connector - then solder as normal. once soldered, wrap the exposed barrel of the terminal with high quality electrical tape or heat shrink it

good luck!

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lcjohnny
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Fri Aug 26, 2022 11:59 pm

I bought a cheap battery terminal crimping tool
like this $45 on Fleebay
but you could buy this
£25 on amatoss
Generic halfords leads
and terminals from VWP
All fine lasted 6,000 miles so far

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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sat Aug 27, 2022 4:12 pm

Did you just stick generic lug terminals in the leads? Can I do that with the leads in situ, or do they have to come off?
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sat Aug 27, 2022 4:49 pm

Hi Trogladyte
Not sure what you mean by "generic lug terminals" ?

I wanted a clean low resistance jount so i used new leads. Meant i could add s little bit of slack to get the cable run easy, no tight turns or rub+points

I used the 16mm2 starter lead and "copper tube connectors from here
VWP tube connectors & VWP starter & battery leads
When you select the item it gives you cable and bolt hole sizes to chose.

Other suppliers are available

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whitmire
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sat Aug 27, 2022 5:42 pm

lcjohnny wrote:
I bought a cheap battery terminal crimping tool
like this $45 on Fleebay
but you could buy this
£25 on amatoss
Generic halfords leads
and terminals from VWP
All fine lasted 6,000 miles so far

Most excellent!!!   I don't even need to make or repair any cables on my fleet/family off scooters but bought one from ebay immediately after seeing your post just to have it in my tool collection. Thanks much Johnny

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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sun Aug 28, 2022 7:18 am


That's not a crimper!


[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]




This is a crimper....


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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sun Aug 28, 2022 2:08 pm

beetle wrote:

That's not a crimper!





This is a crimper....




Since you, Sir, and others here have crimper credentials, might you respond to my inquiry made elsewhere -- yes, I know, it was TLDR  Rolling Eyes  -- as to why a "special crimper" might be needed for the Haisstronica heat-shrink connectors?

See [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

It seems to me that if the solder and heat-shrink functions worked, there would be no need for a crimper.  

Grazie.

Bill
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sun Aug 28, 2022 9:57 pm


Bill, I agree. If these whatsamahoosit solder connectors work as described, there's no need for a crimping tool. The kit in the link on your "Dusted" thread does not require (nor would they survive) crimping.

FYI, I don't like the look of those solder connectors. Just my 2¢.





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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sun Aug 28, 2022 10:31 pm

What are these whatsamahoosit solder connectors of which you speak?

And is the consensus that I can repair these leads then?

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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Sun Aug 28, 2022 11:42 pm


The whatsamahoosits won’t help you with your battery leads, but I say fix them yourself. I would.

Get some correctly sized crimp lugs and either buy a crimping tool you may never use again, or approach your local sparky/wholesaler/tool hire place and beg/pay/rent a tool. Your sparky may do it for nowt, or a pint. Who knows?

Apply heat shrink to the crimped section. Ride!


Oh, LINKY for whosamawhatsits.



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Oz1200Guzzi
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Mon Aug 29, 2022 1:35 am

Soldering is the right choice for "some" connections. They are really not appropriate in most motorcyle applications.

Sure you may get away with it, however.

Crimping is the connection of choice for harsh environments. Your GRiSO, Sport, Le Mans (et al) is a harsh environment. Using the correct crimpers will allow the joint to be virtually a solid piece of copper.

Soldering, on the other hand, is fraught with difficulties. Heat control is important (as is having the correct heating element for the job) - not too hot nor too cool. Flux of the right type needs to be applied. Fittings need to be clean for good solder flow.

Apart from that, a soldered joint will wick up the wire a little bit, if it is done right. In the harsh environment that is our bikes, a solder wicked piece of wire will not flex as is the original design. In fact, as it tries to flex, it will work harden the wire and the joint. This will result in a failed (i.e. broken) connection which will very difficult to repair effectively without replacing wire.

Moral of this sermon: "don't be a tool, use the correct tool"!

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rick pope
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Mon Aug 29, 2022 2:50 am

Like Tony said, you won't find any soldered connections on most large trucks or heavy machinery.

I've use the heat solder/shrink connectors. They're a very poor substitute for a proper repair.
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Mon Aug 29, 2022 3:57 am


Completely disagree.

My GRiSO is riddled with soldered connections. Quite a few have replaced the poorly crimped factory stuff. 90% of a motorcycle’s loom never moves. In the case of Bill’s repair, the cable does not move at that location relative to the bevel box.


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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Mon Aug 29, 2022 11:52 am


Apologies for starting a solder skirmish -- I've been in the soldier kind! Shocked  

Seriously, as most here know, I am a terrible tyro in all things moto-mechanical, and the least of my "skills" involves moto-electrical matters.

I won't say that I really don't care what is technically "best," but I am way more concerned what is "good enough" AND doable by me.  

I finally have the OEM part on its way, with the all-in-one butt connectors beating it here by a few days.  

My goal is to have the latter done in time to ride the GRiSO to Tennessee.  If so, I'll have the OEM cable in a pannier.  Then, I'll sit back, quaff a few beers, and watch the Spine Raiders swarm it and R&R the cable.  cheers

Failing that splendid plan, I'll ride something else to the SSR, and post more insipid drivel later about my struggle with solder and the like.

I very much appreciate the various views on how to (re)connect wiring, and learn something from those and every time I screw up.  The costs for you are the pix and words I post, which, along with the curses, are therapy for me.   Wink

Bill

P.S. Apologies, @Trogladyte, for diverting things away from your battery-terminal questions.
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Tue Aug 30, 2022 12:02 am

I replaced both my 2007 GRiSO battery leads with 4ga wire and new CRIMPED terminals with heat shrink...
I work in the A/C industry... almost ALL of the terminals used on wire bigger than 14ga are crimped... the key is having the correct die for the gauge wire.
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Tue Aug 30, 2022 12:15 am


Let's be clear..I am referring to Bill's speedo sensor repair when taking solder.

For battery leads, crimping is the only sensible solution.

Too much thread drift.





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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Tue Aug 30, 2022 12:49 am

beetle wrote:

Let's be clear..I am referring to Bill's speedo sensor repair when taking solder.

For battery leads, crimping is the only sensible solution.

Too much thread drift.







I will say no more here about my sensor repair.

And, I will flay myself unmercifully for contributing to the drift.  Sad

OTOH, perhaps it would be more fun to let Kathi do the lashing.  cheers

Bill
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Tue Aug 30, 2022 12:56 am

Bill Hagan wrote:

OTOH, perhaps it would be more fun to let Kathi do the lashing.  cheers

Bill




Shocked







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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Tue Aug 30, 2022 1:58 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Tue Aug 30, 2022 11:19 pm

This is not a soldering thread nor is it a soddering thread. However it makes a nice change from an oil or tyre thread.

However some things may have been learnt or ignored.

Interesting video, real modern too.
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Wed Aug 31, 2022 6:52 am

Was hoping for a story about fork tube wear on the end of the battery thing?

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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Wed Aug 31, 2022 11:42 am

There's another thread somewhere about my forks. I thought the seals failed, but the problem was the chrome had worn through. After much wailing and gnashing of teeth I discovered that none of the professionals would refurbish, as their success rate with getting the hub lug things off and back on successfully was so low. Next discovery was that used ones are made from 100% unobtanium...
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Wed Aug 31, 2022 12:24 pm

If it's really impossible to find someone capable of getting the castings off why not buy an alternative? The Sachs forks I have on the yellow bike cost me less than $1,000 landed from the US. I had to get the bottom yoke bored and some shims made for the top but they were a pretty easy fit-up.

I've got Matris internals in mine but the originals could be made to work quite acceptably. Using Aprilia Tuono forks, (Off a V4.) also means that the spindle, spacer, brakes etc are all an easy bolt up.

Eg.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Do a search for RSV4 forks and you can probably pick up a set of Ohlins for less than £1,000.

Trog? If you can't find your original thread why not start a new one rather than tacking a message on to a completely irrelevant thread? It'll get a much better response and avoids thread drift.
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PostSubject: Re: Battery leads   Battery leads Icon_minitime1Thu Sep 01, 2022 4:06 pm

Thanks Pete - interesting.
Incidentally, I wasn't trying to kick off a new discussion on the forks - it was just a reply to Buelbloke. Given the state of my Brian, I probably misunderstood what he was getting at anyway.

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