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ghezzi
GRiSO Capo
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PostSubject: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:17 am

Had opportunity today to complete running in of a Kawasaki Z1000 before I get it dyno'd with new pipes etc for a client.
Ohlins etc. already fitted.

First problem, didn't want to turn compared to Bella, but making adjustments and riding to conditions things seemed better the longer I rode.
Second problem, 138HP (claimed ..... at crank). Well whatever the numbers it had shitloads compared to Bella. Ist gear roll-ons result in violent wheelies between 60 & 80k.
It was more fun just doing top gear roll-ons from 100 to 185kph, fairly ballistic but cruising at 100 its already doing 4,500rpm. Felt like it needed another gear or bigger front sprocket.
Sounds and feels busy, all the time.

After saying for so long I don't need more than Bella's 76rwhp, well, I don't need more ............... but power is intoxicating and it is amazing how quick you can adapt. (wannabe)
Not saying I could use all of it, but was certainly squirting it out of corners harder than what I am used to. Mid corner speed for me though was slower.
Riding position was Ok, rear brake needs lots of pressure, = good feel. Front brake was uninspiring, lacks initial bite yet powerful enough but overall feel was a bit ordinary.

Hated its 'kini fairing, directed full air blast to your face.
Hated its buzzing vibrations and constant numb hands.
Hated its 190 rear tyre and resultant slow tip in.
Hated its pissy 15L tank, 180k to reserve.
Hated changing down 6 gears for every red light. (due to its engine flexibility and low overall gearing, you use top gear in town).

So what more can I say, if you read this its a bigger waste of your time than it was mine riding it.

I'll have a Guzzi next ride thanks.
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Sun Oct 26, 2014 7:04 pm

We switch bike with a friend of mine than owns a Ninja 1000...
Wasn't impressed a bit, more power than the GRiSO sure but unless you rev this thing up you have a plain sewing machine.
And that stock exhaust, yikes! And the seat... I was glad to get off of it after 20 minutes.
My old souped up 500RG Gamma (1986) would put than thing to shame on every level, except for torque maybe.
I also rode a 2012 800 Tiger and a 1983 R100RS this week end, both bored me to death really.
I realize that none of these bikes are/were aimed to performance bit it made all the sense to me to jump back on my big Guzzi.
The GRiSO is truly a winner...
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DungeonMaster
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Sun Oct 26, 2014 8:19 pm

I rode a Triumph Triple many months ago and it had a problem getting on the gas.
The salesman told me that I was spoiled by the GRiSO Torque.
That wasn't it. I know the difference between "more torque" and "can't take gas".

The GRiSO is truly a winner

Grisonut for the win.
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:32 am

Wow! You guys are harsh!
I just traded my Kawi Ninja 1000 and it was tough to let it go. Yeah the seat is shitty, but Sargent makes an awesome replacement, and the pipes are awkward looking, but slip on a set of Akrapovics and... nice.  One tooth more on the countershaft sprocket and it accelerates even harder for some reason, plus the speedo is sorted out (7% too high stock). Add other nice touches like hard bags, Scottoiler, Denali driving lights, and heated grips, and you have yourself a bonafide cross country, road-burning back road monster! 240kph bags on and loaded! (if you don't like your license, or freedom that is)
And about triples: I have a Triumph 800XC triple in my garage now, and it stays. That engine is sweet beyond sweet! Nothing better than the triumph for a long day in the saddle. The engine is just as tractable as the kawi, less powerful fur sure, but so, so smooth. And sure, it doesn't have the punch of the 8V, but it's a different kind of cat man. If I had to describe it, the Triumph's torque is more like a spring unwinding, and the GRiSO would be a big fucking hammer!

Hey man, I like them both: If I'm in a mellow mood, or I'm headed for the horizon, I choose the triumph - Don't get me wrong -There ain't no chicken strips on the Tiger - It's just more relaxing to ride, and that could be all day FWIW.
If I've had a hard day at the orifice, and I need to vent: Then hellooo Mr GRiSO. I didn't buy this bike to tour, I've got that covered. I bought it because it screams "Go fuck yourself" ever so impolitely to the asshole in the Camry trying to see what I ate for lunch - plus it makes me smile that maniacal smile that we all get when we uncork the Mistral. Heh-heh-heh....

I like all bikes, it's in my blood. Not one type of bike that I don't like. They all have their merits - except cruisers- fucking useless pieces of shit! Of all the moronic ways to bolt two wheels and an engine together.. Like who the hell thought that one up? Remember the R1200C? Yikes! And you might as well take any two Harley's and bolt them together cause one ain't gonna run, so at least you'll have a makeshift sidecar. And, and.... What?! 12:33 am?? K... Done.
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grisorosso
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Nov 25, 2014 2:07 pm

Kinda starved here for choice.
Saw my first Bellagio on Sunday. That's a cruiser. Pullback t-bars, fat arse seat, fat bob style tank, yet seemingly small overall compared to the GRiSO.

Followed a head down arse up Triumph something for 20ks, whining exhaust, the pillion probably deaf. Later on followed a Triumph Rocket 3 cruiser thing. All I could see were the riders splayed out legs and the bike bouncing around on bumps. Rider looked comfortable.
BUT, when both bikes accelerated hard from 120-130kph, fuck me, figuratively I was left standing.

Have owned Harleys big twins of various persuasions on and off for 25 years, they can be made to work okay for what they are. Reliable too.
I don't know if the big Cali offerings of Guzzi compare to them, or even if they're a good thing. Still haven't seen one. Sure would like to try one, just for fun. Oh sorry, that's a cruiser too.

Still waiting to see a Japanese bike which truly captures my interest.
Liked the Bellagio in a musing way.
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ghezzi
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Nov 25, 2014 9:34 pm

Come to BrizVegas and I'll let you ride a real Bellagio.
As for the 1100 Cali variants, they'll chew up any other cruiser on the market, then spit them out the other end, in masticated little pieces. Cali's still have Brembo brakes, various European suspension components and the one thing all other cruisers don't have. Ground clearance!

Make that two things, Class!
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DungeonMaster
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:33 pm

If I'm going to deviate from a Guzzi or Laverda it sure ain't going to be a Kawi 1000.
That Yamaha FZ09 triple is intrigueing. But not a big four.

DM
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Triman023
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Nov 26, 2014 8:54 am

The only other bike I ride is my 69 Triumph Bonneville. It has everything except the power and it wants to shake itself to death over 5,000 RPM's. One of the few bikes that can out handle the GRiSO. I do have to think ahead with the drum brakes but that keeps me focused..

And the kick starting is a privilege.

Now if the GRiSO weighed 395lbs, that would be something! Very Happy
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ghezzi
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Nov 26, 2014 3:35 pm

Hey Bella weighs only 210k (460lbs) fully wet, is that close enough?
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Triman023
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Nov 26, 2014 3:59 pm

Go on that special diet and lose 60lbs and you are there!
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DungeonMaster
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Nov 26, 2014 10:54 pm

So get Bella and then refer to the "Café Racer" TV show for transformation tips.
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:13 pm

Harry said
I like all bikes, it's in my blood. Not one type of bike that I don't like. They all have their merits - except cruisers- fucking useless pieces of shit! Of all the moronic ways to bolt two wheels and an engine together.. Like who the hell thought that one up? Remember the R1200C? Yikes! And you might as well take any two Harley's and bolt them together cause one ain't gonna run, so at least you'll have a makeshift sidecar. And, and.... What?! 12:33 am?? K... Done.

Classic, I needed a bit of a laugh.

Harry
The one in OZ
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DungeonMaster
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Sat Nov 29, 2014 6:29 am

Ya wanna gripe about cruisers??
I got one word for ya - understeer.
NO BIKE should be cursed with understeer.
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Mon Dec 01, 2014 10:36 pm

You know... Nothing against one's personal preferences in motorcycles. I just think that form should follow function - as is the case with most sport or dirt bikes - and not the opposite- which is the case with more than just a few of the cruisers on the market today.
Isn't the basic shape of the motorcycle and its riding position pretty much a function of its intended purpose? If so, then what would the intended purpose of, say a HD Seventy-two Sportster be? Sure it's a neat looking bike with all that mid-70's Glastron metal flakey paint and all that chrome, but what the hell is it good for?  I think it's good for looking at - if that's your thing - but I'm not so sure about the riding part of the equation.
I like to ride. I like to ride the twisties and scrape the pegs once in a while. I occasionally like to ride to far off places and take a week or two to do it. Now, granted, one could argue that a cruiser could fill all of those roles, but not me. I like my bikes to be a little more focused.


Last edited by Harry Paratestes on Mon Dec 01, 2014 10:38 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Fell asleep at the wheel....)
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ghezzi
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Dec 02, 2014 12:44 am

RE. Twisties & scraping.

Your preaching to the converted here Harry, no Cali14's on this forum. Yet.
I would be the closest clown here with a Bellagio, but I think I've managed to shift the goal posts a little.
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Street
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Dec 02, 2014 11:29 am

My wife, Esther had a Cali 1400 for a year and loved it for 9000 miles, but our misfortunes in the Yukon this summer changed her outlook completely. She finally came to agree with me that the bike was really too big for her to handle. In Alaska we rode to the ends of several roads just to explore, but when she had to turn the ship around at the end of a two-lane highway it was a painful thing to watch. I could just zip the GRiSO around and keep going, but she'd have to stop and with both feet on the ground, with unsure footing due to loose sand and gravel, make a fourteen point turn to get the beast facing in the opposite direction. And then have to start out all over again. Or when it came to parking it in a dicey situation she'd often end up stopping it on the biggest flat spot she could find and leaving it for me to properly park. When I had my unfortunate crash, she arrived a few minutes later and then dumped it trying to start out in the deep, loose gravel that caused me to go down. Now, it may sound like I'm bitching about my wife not being able to handle her own shit, but that's not my point. I'm always happy to give her a hand. The point is, that bike is too big and heavy, period. As soon as we got home from that ill-fated trip, she traded it in on a V7 Stone and you wouldn't believe how she grins every time she gets on it. I would love for her to have a GRiSO, but she doesn't like the ergonomics, says it just doesn't feel right to her, and I didn't push it since it was probably my fault she got the Cali in the first place. It's important for her to be comfortable on her own bike and she has regained her confidence in being able to handle the V7 all by herself. We installed the after-market sump extension for greater oil capacity, heated grips, a substantial fairing and a set of HB 20 liter hard bags and she's ready to hit the road again.

The Cali 1400 is a pretty awesome motorcycle, but it's a cruiser and a pig, let's be honest. Me, I love the GRiSO so much I'm trying to figure out how to get my hands on another one so I'll have a back-up for when this one wears out.
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plantboy
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:38 pm

Good decision on the V7 Stone, Street. In recent years my wife has owned an Aprilia Sportcity 200 (return to 2 wheels after a long absence), an MG Nevada (for the low seat), V7 C (love at first sight but quality issues), BMW F800 R (quick and safe but lacked soul), and now a V7 Stone which she says is 'just perfect', and which I also get to ride from time to time. Very Happy
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DungeonMaster
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Dec 02, 2014 9:15 pm

"you wouldn't believe how she grins"
Very Good barometer there. Keep the V7.
As far as cruisers go I don't care for them but IF I were to get one it would be a Guzzi!!!!!!
Ano 2000 Bassa to be exact.

DM
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Tue Dec 02, 2014 10:15 pm

Street wrote:


The Cali 1400 is a pretty awesome motorcycle, but it's a cruiser and a pig, let's be honest. Me, I love the GRiSO so much I'm trying to figure out how to get my hands on another one so I'll have a back-up for when this one wears out.

And that, in a nutshell, is my feeling too.

Jude and I did 11,000 odd miles on a Cali in 2013 touring the U.S. probably the 'Holiday of a lifetime' although we will be back again, maybe next year. Thing is I bought the Cali because I really wanted to try the whole 'Big Cruiser' touring experience and you know what? It sucked balls!

Well, no, that is a bit too harsh. We had a fantastic time and without a doubt the Cali is a great big that makes everything else in its class look like the glitter-rolled turds that they are but it wasn't *Our* sort of bike. If we had the chance again we would of done it on the Mana GT I still own in Los Angeles. Every time we saw a sort road leading off to yonder that we wanted to explore we would sigh and say "Not on this. Wish we were on the Mana."

Touring two up on the GRiSO is a complete non-starter for us. Jude is sixty, I'm only a couple of years behind and its a torture rack for her and most other pillions who aren't young and lithe! Thing is though that we found the Cali ultimately un satisfying for us. I could go on at length but at the end of the day of I just say that I think any big touring bike that doesn't have quickly detatchable panniers that can be unclipped and carried into a hotel is a joke! A seat that murders your arse is also stupid! I took a huge hit when we sold it but really, I was glad to see the back of it. If we come over again next year we'll be Mana mounted once more and we'll love it!

Pete
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:35 pm

I test rode the big Cali and while I too, think it's an awesome bike with a great mill, I can't do cruisers and that's that.
I don't wanna cruise, I wanna ride.
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rboe
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:23 am

I have spent a LOT of time on crappy seats and small bike going across North and South Dakota, Montana and chunks of Minnesota and Wisconsin back in the day. A cruiser would be great on those roads.

Test rode the new Indian Classic and could see getting one (for mile crunching). But for now, the GRiSO is my touring bike. Lighter than those beasts. Good thrumming from the engine room, torque, now has heated working grips and that oh so wonderful yet ugly Russell Day Long seat.

Took a ride up to Payson Arizona on the CB1100 a couple weekends ago. It has the Laam custom seat, good for 5-6 hours, not as nice as the RDL, his customer service is not great either. But I could not fault the bike on the ride. Does not feel as planted as the GRiSO in the fast sweepers, but did not feel unplanted either. Does not get up and go like the GRiSO but I found myself at 80mph a few times without realizing it and she was very stable. It's a very torquie bike with a very very flat torque curve; just does not have the power pulses like the GRiSO, just comes on like pouring milk.

Had a sporty car (Japanese, Nissan looking thing) pass me the other day going real fast. Way too fast. He had to stop and turn at the same light I had to so I caught up. When we turned I put on the coals to pass him and was only able to keep up with him to about 105mph when I backed down - too nuts for me. Kinda wished for a Hayabusa or Concours at that point. Smile
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Dec 10, 2014 4:56 pm

Funny, I test rode the new 1100 CB this past Sunday... mehhh.
Didn't think it had much torque and I found myself spinning that engine a lot to get it going.
But your description is accurate I guess.

This damn GRiSO is fucking up my motorcycle taste buds!!
I used to feel spoiled on any bike back in the days... now I'm kinda bored on any other bike just about.
Some is wrong with me...


Last edited by Grisonut on Thu Jan 29, 2015 4:43 pm; edited 1 time in total
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rboe
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:06 pm

The CB is sneaky that way. I can pull away from the curb off of idle. Without feathering the clutch. The thing is, it's so damn smooth, with out those major power pulses the GRiSO gives you that your normal indication of acceleration is off a bit.

If you put her to the coals there is a high speed rush that comes on in the upper rpm ranges that approaches the GRiSO (a wee bit of work and and reflash will have her matching the power of the GRiSO or exceeding it - but then, why didn't you buy a CBR if you wanted that?). But the CB is a whole different attitude. Like a Buick vs. a Boss Mustang. Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don't.

Luckily I have both (and the 650L for real wild thumper torque action). If I had to sell all the bikes but one, right now I'd keep the GRiSO. There are days the CB comes out on top, but not many. I was looking at some older Hondas to relive my youth, mainly a pre-1980's naked Goldwing but this CB scratches all those itches without resorting carbs in a modern chassis and brakes that are better than the GRiSO's. Still, she has shims, two too many pistons and the stock seat was too low but I like her. In my neck of the woods GRiSO's are more common than CB's so oddly enough, she scratches the Odd Man Out Bike too. Very Happy

She is not for everyone and with so many good bikes out there, pick your poison. We can agree on the GRiSO!!
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Thu Dec 11, 2014 6:56 am

The CB I rode had the reflash but my bike felt stronger still.
The brakes on the Honda were stronger, no doubts. Took no pressure at all.
The brakes on the GRiSO are there (I already locked the front wheel) but you have to press the lever harder so the points go to the CB on that one.
The other thing is, the Honda sounds like the old CBs and while not as intoxicating as a V twin, I still liked the old 4 in-line sound. Very Happy

Good on Honda for coming up with this bike... Smile
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Enzo the baker
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PostSubject: Re: Not a Guzzi alternative.   Not a Guzzi alternative. Icon_minitime1Sat Jan 24, 2015 9:18 am

My riding partner has a 2014 California, the no bags no windshield one, just an abbreviated sport shield.We have been riding together over 10 years, his Cali will pull a little harder than my 2013 GRiSO SE. They both handle well, although his floor boards scrape before my kickstand or lowered pegs find terra firma. We have chased each other all over Arizona, through big sweepers and tight corners, for me the GRiSO gets the edge overall.  However it's a bike I would buy this year if I sell my 1200 GT. JMHO
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