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 Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe

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MrButter
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PostSubject: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:22 pm

Short story  - my '07 GRiSO 1100 is running like a bag of wet snail dicks.... Won't rev out past 6k , and down on power  (max 120kmph flogging it) Fluffy over rich throttle feel, smelly hunting rich idle, and high fuel consumption (from 5.5 to 6.5) ... suggestions please squires?

Air filter ok, fuel lines look good ... Airbox has some large gobs of cheesy mayonnaise emminating  from the crankcase  vent box seperator thingy tube ..... .... Now I am wondering if water ingress can happen...

The long hi-story ...

Running a stainless termi pipe, old beetle map , and now injectors and fuel lines from a Breva 1100  (recent addition in last 6 month due to a fractured plug connector.) , Much easier to deal with than the solid GRiSO fuel lines...

G11 is on 94k Kms now... No big issues in the last year or so, other than rough stumbly idle caused by  a couple of disintegrated inner plug caps...  Now sorted, Serviced recently , TBs  and valves ok...


Last edited by MrButter on Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:26 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Papa Lazarou
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:22 pm

Water has got in somehow and somewhere. Check for leaks on any oil lines.
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:11 pm

Water gets in past the rings, it's one of the major by-products of combustion. In cooler weather mayonaise will form in the rocker covers and blow by system. This doesn't explain why it sounds like it's running rich. Are you getting any error codes being thrown?

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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:08 pm

No errors showing on guzzi diag . I checked the left pot plug, sooty outer, grey center...

Never seen mayo in the airbox before, but I have been running in foggy 5 degree night commutes this week.

I'll bumblefuck through the troubleshooting and check everything from scratch... Tank is off , and crank breather seperator box pulled ( as was weeping oil anyhoo) ... Will try again in daylight.


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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:13 am

I'd check the coils just for good measure since it's running rich, weak spark me think... slight corrosion on contact prong etc...
I know the tank is off but did you see any contaminants in it by any chance?
It might be a shot in the dark since you're in Europe but we have crappy gas in the US and some cheap gas station sometimes get compromised fuel either due to fraudulent behavior or poor maintenance. You won't smell it necessarily but the fuel is bad regardless.
I also remember that the early 1100 (06 to mid 07) had a fuel pump issue with its feeding tube that either came off or got itself crooked in the tank thus, creating fuel delivery problems. There was a recall for that...
Yours has too many miles by now for it to occur but one can never know for sure.

I'm interested to see what the problem is with your bike since I have the same one...
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ghezzi
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:35 am

Stepper motor needs cleaning?
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avgpetro
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:55 am

I think mayo is harder to show up on a G11, as it has a thermostatic oil valve (gu01163500), that I believe bypass the cooler, so it doesn't run too much with too cold oil. (This valve does not exist on G12).
Maybe the mayo indicates that this thermostatic oil valve is stuck?
I think i've seen in a manual the process of servicing it...

As Pete wrote, can't figure how mayo relates to running rich...

... Unless ...

What if the oil never heats up, keeping the cylinder cool, the engine temperature sensor measures low temperature, the ECU gives more fuel through the injectors?
Any map gurru around, to say if this make sence?
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:20 am

That's logical. I concur.


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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:42 pm

Solved..... After a full morning bumblesucks 'shooting session, got her back together in time for a lunchtime run up the mountain. Same issue appeared half way up. Frustrated, resorted to Italian tune up...... She cleared and all was smiles and lunch was extra delicious....

On way down, she suddenly went all Harley open pipe on me... The Termi end can had been blown off the link pipe... ... Turns out there is a ball of catalytic converter in the can that has worked loose ... Essentially partially blocking the exit poop... Bumblefuck here had also removed the DB killer ('shooting) which made room to allow a complete blockage and pipe blows off, causing much hilarity and delight !


Next question... Options

1.Remove catballthing.. what's the downside?

2. New pipe (grrr I like my Termi, and can't afford a new one)

3. or find a standard can ... Boring .... What's the upside ,?other than neighbours hating me slightly less ...
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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:18 pm

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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:21 pm

and some gratuitous air box mayo cheese shots [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:32 pm

MrButter wrote:



Next question...   Options

1.Remove catballthing.. what's the downside?



It'll need remapping. Maybe that's an upside?

alien
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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:38 pm

Does such a thing exist in this cold cruel world?

Do you mean if I smash that pesky barsteward catconballer out, there's a decent map to work with that lovely extra flow ?

Don't tease me Beetle...
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:52 pm

There is, but you'll have to leave the dB killer out.


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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:47 am

Nice!!!!! I'll get all smashy on the cattyconballbastard then fella!
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Grisonut
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:16 am

Glad you got that sorted...
DB killer out might be too loud no?
With Mark helping you mapping this thing you'e in good hands anyhow. Thumbs Up
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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Wed Nov 29, 2017 5:25 pm

Well... minus a huge bung in its pipe, the Recalcitrant Orange Whore goes like the clap(pers)... With DB killer in, seems Ok, but probably just because was so god awful previously....

Minus the DB killer , not so great on current map of course, and just on the offensive side of loud (but not as bad as I thought).... Maybe .... But will need to pass annual testing at some point , so will consult with Mark for options.
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Oz1200Guzzi
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:48 pm

DBK out for normal - bung in for roadworthy, get it passed, go home and restore the equilibrium!

It's how mine works - and way too many HD riders do it too.
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sideshowbob
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:47 am

I wonder how they run with cat gone and one of Marks magic maps.
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Oz1200Guzzi
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:52 am

The 2V/Cyl runs pretty well with an open exhaust, Mapping from Beetle can do wonders.
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:03 am

I think I'm pretty much optimized with M high pipe dbo and the corresponding map. Just curios about how the lack of cat would effect performance with a map designed for that scenario.
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beetle
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:33 am

Theoretically, it would run like any other pipe that is properly mapped. The only difference would be peak torque and fuel usage.

alien
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sideshowbob
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:03 am

Thanks Mark!!
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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:41 am

Ok guys, you've persuaded me that a DBO a is more important than social responsibility. Fark the neighborhood I want decent fuelling..
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MrButter
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PostSubject: Re: Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe   Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:42 pm

Late update, in the end , the FIG has persuaded me to keep the neighbours on side, and keep the DB. Have been playing with CO trim and getting better results. To much work and no time to play , but looking very promising so far
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Cheese in my airbox... (G1100, no power , poor running ) SOLVED! = Knackered loose Cat in Termi Pipe
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