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 Oil level on dipstick

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beetle
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Xcountry41
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PostSubject: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sun May 17, 2020 1:00 pm

Hi folks,
Well just completed my second upper sump spacer gasket replacement this week. Have to say the GRiSO was a fair bit more of a PITA due to the kickstand and exhaust. Did not have any spare exhaust header gaskets so really did not want to mess with the pipes to get the stand off. 
So my question is around oil level. Did some searching and found some info, expected that talks about stated capacity being a “little too much” . On the Stelvio dipstick that correlates to about halfway between the low shoulder and upper shoulder on the stick. I’m finding the plastics dipstick on the GRiSO frustrating to read but think it’s reading about halfway between the marks. Can anyone tell me what I should be shooting for? Total volume of oil so far is approx. 3.4litres. As always, any guidance is much appreciated!
Regards, Gary
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sun May 17, 2020 2:40 pm

Yup, the motors are identical, (Your's is a '13 I believe?) yes the sticks are a pain, yes aim for about half way between the 'Add' and 'Full' marks with the bike upright. Once you have it right stick the bike on is side stand and check the oil again. Wherever it is on the stick that's your 'Full' mark for easy checking.

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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Mon May 18, 2020 10:23 am

Xcountry41,  I too found it difficult to read the dipstick. I took a flat file and removed one of the four 'fins' that form the stick. This gave me a flat spot on the stick between the two indicator marks. It made it much easier to read the level. I considered drilling a hole through the stick at the half way mark but I didn't want to weaken the stick more than necessary. I find the flat spot is more than adequate to read the oil. I also found that using a total of 3.3 liters puts the oil level when hot exactly on the midway point. That's with the bike vertical. YMMV.

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Dave R
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:24 pm

Hiya - mind if I jump in on this thread ?

I've had a discussion with Mark on the FB site (on the back of someone else's question) regarding overfilling the oil.  I left it to the dealers who used 3.5 litres - Mark's advised me to drain & refill with 3 litres, which I'll do as soon as I can hold of an o-ring for the sump plug - for some reason they're a rare beastie at the moment.  

From what I've read, the level wants to be mid-point between the "min" & "max" marks on the dip-stick.  The manual advises that the level needs to be read with the stick out (as opposed to being screwed back in) - however, the manual also shows a different stick to the one I have fitted in my bike  (152 mm long) & Mark tells me not to trust any photos in a Guzzi manual.  

So can anyone who has a 2015 model with the same dipstick, tell me if the level is measured with the stick screwed in, or rested on top of the threads ?   This is the stick I have


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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:36 pm

Just get it halfway between the marks with the stick just resting on the threads, bike upright.

Then rest it on the sidestand and check it again. That's as much as you should ever have in it but ride it and as long as it doesn't drop below the 'Add' mark, even on the sidestand, it'll be fine.

You'll probably find it will use a bit and then stop. Wherever it stops and doesn't use any more? That's your new 'Full' mark.

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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:20 am

Hi Dave,

If it was me, I’d drain the oil a little and reuse the drain plug washer again. I’ve done that with no issues and no leaks. You don’t want oil going where it shouldn’t cause it’s over filled.

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Dave R
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:30 am

JohnA wrote:
Hi Dave,

If it was me, I’d drain the oil a little and reuse the drain plug washer again. I’ve done that with no issues and no leaks. You don’t want oil going where it shouldn’t cause it’s over filled.

Thanks John

I'm just on my way to pick up a couple of washers from a local Aprilia stockist - turns out one of the countries largest Aprilia independent parts stockist is nine miles up the road from me !! My intention is to drain out all the oil (it's only been in a couple of months & due to the current situation, has only done a couple of hundred miles), measure out exactly three litres & use that as a starting point. I'm gonna drain it into a plastic tub (just been cleaning it out with brake cleaner), then put it into a graduated plastic container so I can see where I'm at with it, then fill as necessary to the mid point as Peter (& others) have suggested

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Dave R
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:30 am

Pete Roper wrote:
Just get it halfway between the marks with the stick just resting on the threads, bike upright.

Then rest it on the sidestand and check it again. That's as much as you should ever have in it but ride it and as long as it doesn't drop below the 'Add' mark, even on the sidestand, it'll be fine.

You'll probably find it will use a bit and then stop. Wherever it stops and doesn't use any more? That's your new 'Full' mark.

Thanks for confirming it for me Peter - much appreciated
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:17 am

Pete Roper wrote:
Just get it halfway between the marks with the stick just resting on the threads, bike upright.

Then rest it on the sidestand and check it again. That's as much as you should ever have in it but ride it and as long as it doesn't drop below the 'Add' mark, even on the sidestand, it'll be fine.

You'll probably find it will use a bit and then stop. Wherever it stops and doesn't use any more? That's your new 'Full' mark.

Hiya Peter.

Done as you suggested - taken almost 500 ml out to put it on the half way mark.  Is that halfway on cold or hot ?  I've checked it at about 80 degrees

Cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:49 am

Cold or hot doesn't make a lot of difference. Drain down times are pretty quick on Guzzi motors.

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alanlemansiv
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Tue May 03, 2022 6:14 am

I assume that the above applies to 2007 1200 sports
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Tue May 03, 2022 6:28 am

Yup, most recent Big Blocks really and a lot of older ones too. The simple fact is that the crankcase hasn't really got any bigger since '83 when a sump extension was added but the swept volume has gone up and up. On the V11's and 1100 Sports etc with the 'Broad Sump' the crankcase volume actually got smaller!

That leads to increased crankcase pressure and greater windage meaning more oil in the faster moving expelled gas which in turn means greater stress on the breather/condensor/return and re-breathing system.

The specified oil for all the CARC bikes, except perhaps the 850's and the Bellagio, is simply too much. It takes up too much space in the case, runs too close to the crank and essentially will get expelled until it finds the point where it won't.

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Matias
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Jul 21, 2023 9:31 am

Hi everyone,
I was going through this old thread and came across this picture of a dipstick, which is very diferent from mine...I was measuring mine today and it has, measured from the cap, 155mm to Max notch, 185mm to min notch, and 195mm to the tip.
My GRiSO is a 1100 from 2008.
Should they be that different?

One thing puzzles me...
I have learned long ago in this forum that with should not go above half way between min and max, and that's what I do.
However, when I top up to that point, it doesn't take long for the oil going down to minimum...As it gets there it seems to stabilize, but I'm affraid to keep riding that low...
I also don't understand where the oil is going...
- The bike seems not being burning it....no smoke, exhaust is dry, spark plugs are dry....
- It doesn't seem to be blowing it out....I see no oil in the transparent drain hoses and the last time I removed the air box it was clean...
- I have an ocasional drip from the main seal, but that's all...

Where is it going?...
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Matias
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Jul 21, 2023 9:33 am

The picture was missing

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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Fri Jul 21, 2023 2:06 pm

It's blowing it out through the breather system and yes, it is being burnt. Excess oil causes a lot more of it to be held in suspension in droplet form in the gas within the crankcase. The crankcase will always have positive pressure due to blow-by from the rings etc. and therefore gas, with oil suspended within it, will be expelled through the breather system. While most of it will be recovered by the condensor box and returned to the motor over time the excess will be expelled into the airbox and re-breathed through the motor.

You say that your oil level seems to stabilise at about the 'Low' mark on the stick? Fine! That's where it's happy! Leave it there. There is PLENTY of oil in a Guzzi big block. Even at the minimum mark you'll have more than 2 & 1/2 litres in there and it doesn't get worked very hard, there are only five bearing journals, a chain, four cam/tappet interfaces, a chain and a couple of rockers for it to cool and protect. A Subaru WRX has about the same amount of oil and has a lot more work to do as well as cooling a turbocharger with stacked bearings! Not even they blow up as often as they should! Laughing

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Matias
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sat Jul 22, 2023 7:25 am

Thanks Pete.
Why the hell similar engines stabilize at different oil leves? And why the different dipsticks? Why is the sky blue?.......

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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sat Jul 22, 2023 2:49 pm


Because physics.






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Matias
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sat Jul 22, 2023 3:16 pm

And another curiosity: I checked the oil leves um vertical position (or very close to it with a wooden block under the side stand), and with the bike in normal side stand position, and the difference on the oil level readings was minimal...Anyone with a similar experience?
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sun Jul 23, 2023 7:04 am

Matias wrote:
And another curiosity: I checked the oil leves um vertical position (or very close to it with a wooden block under the side stand), and with the bike in normal side stand position, and the difference on the oil level readings was minimal...Anyone with a similar experience?

This is an example of Guzzi's good engineering cheers : The angle they chose for the dipstick hole means that the dipstick enters the oil (when the level is right) near the centreline of the bike. For that reason the level up the stick will be similar with the bike level or on the side-stand. cheers

But i still don't understand scratch why they chose to put the filler on the downhill side of the crankcase - instead of on the uphill side or on the rocker box like BMW scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sun Jul 23, 2023 1:28 pm

Not on rocker covers for aesthetics (& you'd need a very long dipstick if you measure oil level down the same hole Wink )....On the downhill so that you can't get a std funnel in there easily hence the oil leaks over the casings & exhaust when you fill it & Agip/Motul sell more oil...

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Matias
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Sun Jul 23, 2023 11:46 pm

Thanks guys.
Once that Paulbrice mentioned the Agip/Motul options: I have been using Agip/Eni Ride since the first day (the bike has now 50.000 km), but I will try Motul 7100 10W40 the next time.
Can you give any feed back regarding your experience with Motul? Can this oil have a better resistance to the behaviors described by Pete?
Thanks
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Matias
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Mon Jul 24, 2023 1:24 am

Correction: it's Motul 7100 10W60
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Mon Jul 24, 2023 2:13 am

Any, and I mean ANY decent quality synthetic will be fine. On the 1100 you could run it on Yak Fat and it will be quite happy. It's the same engine they've built since 1967 and oils have got a LOT better since then!

The 8V benefits from a more wide spectrum oil but simply because it runs so cool in a lot of circumstances. The oil has a defined 'Cooling' function in the 8V beyond the usual cooling function of oil.

Put oil in it. Thrash the bejasus out of it for 10,000 Km. Change the oil and filter. Repeat. It will long outlive you!
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Mon Jul 24, 2023 4:14 am

I run Bertoli extra virgin 1060 olive and it smells and tastes good too
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1Mon Jul 24, 2023 4:21 am

Tim Henry wrote:
I run Bertoli extra virgin 1060 olive and it smells and tastes good too
Forza!!

That might keep it warm enough in UK Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Oil level on dipstick   Oil level on dipstick Icon_minitime1

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