Subject: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 4:05 am
Hi and help We are on holiday in N Spain & yesterday the bike started popping when engine braking with small throttle openings. Then in the middle of a real cloud-burst it cut out on the right cylinder, at first intermittent then completely. Got back (slowly) to the place we are staying: 35 miles. catalytic convertor red hot visible from behind! Probably burning fuel!
Looked at it today.
Rt pipe cold when running. Seems to start on two and immediately drops to one cylinder ticking over at about 1,050 rpm. SERVICE warning showing plus red triangle. But only diagnostic error shown is an historical Dashboard code DSB07, nothing in current or in ECU error codes.
Checked and, cleaned all fuses, coil wring and HT. All looks good except rt plug wet. Swapped plugs, caps, leads and coils left to right: problem stays on right cylinder.
Checked ECU plugs both intact, clean, no corrosion. Tank off, checked all wiring, no damage no visible problems.
Re-assembled, started on 2 dropped immediately to left cylinder only and same error code showing.
Help please any ideas??
Last edited by lcjohnny on Sat Jun 04, 2022 5:06 pm; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : originally entered on a fone)
beetle GRiSO Capo
Posts : 10180 Join date : 2013-09-30
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 4:49 am
. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] . In GRiSO we trust! .
Pete Roper GRiSO Capo
Posts : 10667 Join date : 2013-05-29 Age : 67
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 5:19 am
Still on the original plug caps? That's the most likely cause. Source SB05E or F caps and it will probably cure it.
Guzzi Cat likes this post
lcjohnny GRiSO Capo
Posts : 1470 Join date : 2016-01-25 Age : 69
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 5:49 am
Thanks but Ngk 05 angled caps fitted, tight and no sign of damage. Swapped and the problem stayed on the right side
eighteight likes this post
BrianD Don Abbondio
Posts : 166 Join date : 2015-12-19
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 6:51 am
maybe try a compression test
lcjohnny GRiSO Capo
Posts : 1470 Join date : 2016-01-25 Age : 69
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 7:47 am
Valve gear on the right looks good... but will check compression on return home
lcjohnny GRiSO Capo
Posts : 1470 Join date : 2016-01-25 Age : 69
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Mon May 23, 2022 10:03 am
I would like to disconnect the right side injector to reduce the fuel wash in the "resting" cylinder when i ride the 210mile home. With the injector disconnected it shows errors ecu25 and ecu31. Any advice?
Apologies for the spark plug comment. I didn't read your first post properly.
If swapping everything left to right didn't change anything, it can only be the lead from the ECU*. Check the ground (Red/Brown wire) and pop the ECU and check the pins.
. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] . In GRiSO we trust! .
lcjohnny GRiSO Capo
Posts : 1470 Join date : 2016-01-25 Age : 69
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Wed May 25, 2022 2:55 am
Yes coils swap shows both coil-wire-cap-plug sets are fine. Brown-stripe-on-red switched earth works for both injectors and left coil.
So am looking at continuity between ecu brown connector pins 10 & 38 and coil connectors. Just bought a multimetro then back to the bike
Last edited by lcjohnny on Thu May 26, 2022 8:11 am; edited 1 time in total
beetle GRiSO Capo
Posts : 10180 Join date : 2013-09-30
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Wed May 25, 2022 3:43 am
My apologies. The red/brown wire is +12V from secondary injection relay. The ECU grounds the coil via the blue/green wire to fire it. Amongst other things, the fuel pump is also powered via the secondary injection relay. You should have +12V on the red/brown wire with the key on.
. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] . In GRiSO we trust! .
lcjohnny likes this post
lcjohnny GRiSO Capo
Posts : 1470 Join date : 2016-01-25 Age : 69
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Wed May 25, 2022 3:46 am
Thanks, misread the switching lol
lcjohnny GRiSO Capo
Posts : 1470 Join date : 2016-01-25 Age : 69
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Wed May 25, 2022 7:19 am
Multimetro results continuity test between (1)Left coil connector orange/green to orange/green at 38 on brown ecu socket = 100% connectivity no breaks, damage or resistance Between (2) Right coil connector blue/green and blue/green at 10 on brown ecu socket. 100% connectivity no breaks, damage or resistance (3) 100% continuity between left and right red/brown coil wires
Coil feed and earth measurements (With battery in 12.6v, ecu replugged) (1) left (working) side _a) ignition off: __(i) brown/red 0.01v falling to 0v __(ii) orange/green on 0.01v falling to 0v
_b) Ignition switched on: __(i) brown/red 0.01v falling to 0v __(ii) orange/green fluctuates then settles at0.04v
(2) right (no spark) side _a) ignition off: __(i) brown/red 0.01v falling to 0v __(ii) blue/green 10.47v rising to 11.05v
It certainly does seem like a an ECU issue. SSR or gate stuck in the wrong state, maybe.
There's no circuit diagram for the ECU, so just guessing. Might be worth disconnecting the battery +ve and switching the key on to let any caps discharge in the ECU. Might unstick it. Long shot. Alternatively, find the nearest Ducati and knock of its ECU.
After you figure out the ECU if you bike doesn't want to rev you might've melted part of the catalytic converter causing a restriction in the exhaust. That's what happened to me back when I had plug boot issues on my 2009 and had to ride it a ways on one cylinder to get back to civilization.
Beetle said "Might be worth disconnecting the battery +ve and switching the key on to let any caps discharge in the ECU." Thanks i will try that
The MuffinMan said " might've melted part of the catalytic converter causing a restriction in the exhaust" That is there other reason i want to ride with that injector disabled. I will get a lift in a van to Bilbao so only the last 95 miles to ride.
Replacing ecu, 2nd hand ones rare at £250 and up new at £1000. Can i use any w5am and just plug and play with existing dash, keys and lock? Or is it more detailed than that?
Pete Roper GRiSO Capo
Posts : 10667 Join date : 2013-05-29 Age : 67
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Thu May 26, 2022 12:18 am
lcjohnny wrote:
Beetle said "Might be worth disconnecting the battery +ve and switching the key on to let any caps discharge in the ECU." Thanks i will try that
The MuffinMan said " might've melted part of the catalytic converter causing a restriction in the exhaust" That is there other reason i want to ride with that injector disabled. I will get a lift in a van to Bilbao so only the last 95 miles to ride.
Replacing ecu, 2nd hand ones rare at £250 and up new at £1000. Can i use any w5am and just plug and play with existing dash, keys and lock? Or is it more detailed than that?
If you can afford to wait I can slip one in a baggy and send it over? You’ll need to stick a suitable map in it but if it cures the problem then at least you’ll know it is the ecu. If it is? Just find a Ducati W5AM with the same HW number and you’ll be good to go.
I’m still a bit skeptical as the only one I’ve ever replaced was actually *Physically* damaged!
lcjohnny likes this post
Steak Godfather
Posts : 3154 Join date : 2013-05-28 Age : 59
Subject: Re: Breakdown, ignition failur Rt cylinder Thu May 26, 2022 2:08 am
This is why I like this forum so much. Thanks to all for sharing knowledge and ideas.
--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
2012 MOTO GUZZI GRiSO 1200SE
2013 MOTO GUZZI STELVIO 1200NTX - Orange Blossom Special