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 GRiSO Clutch

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GhostBullet
Grignapoco
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PostSubject: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 1:00 am

I was looking on youtube at GRiSO stuff as ya do, and come across this clutch replacement. Now it would appear the owner of this GRiSO really did not need to replace it.
My bike, looming in on 200k... yeah ok, its prob more due to a look at the clutch.
But watching this series of 3 videos made me cringe a little.
I like the idea of attacking the task myself, unsure if I need any special tools. (did not look like they used any)
But the problems of broken or damaged fasteners.... damn... that's a nightmare

Begs the question, when the time is right, do I do the task myself, or take to a shop?

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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 1:23 am

It's up to you. There is nothing terrifically difficult in replacing the clutch but you do have to drop the motor out of the frame to remove the gearbox. There is a YouTube vid up by some bloke in the UK, dunno if it's the one you're referring to, where the shop he took the bike to pulled the motor off the front of the gearbox! A stupider, more difficult and risk prone way of trying to do it I've never seen! It's far, far easier to just pull the swingarm and final drive, remove the airbox and just lift the frame off the motive unit. You can get the idea by looking at Steve's avatar.

As for the clutch itself you will need the clutch alignment tool or an old clutch boss with a suitable bolt, nut and washer to collapse the springs for assembly. Not using an alignment tool and compressing the springs is a recipe for bending the intermediate plate in the clutch which you won't find out about until you try to use it and find you're going to have to do the job all over again! Be kind and shout it a new intermediate plate as well. They aren't expensive.

At your mileage I'd recommend replacing the gearbox input boss as it will almost certainly be worn and getting the pressure plate and ring gear face ground flat again. When sourcing clutch plates try to get factory AP plates and avoid Surflex like the plague! Their splines are made of chocolate and will chop out in 15,000 Km! As long as your TB's have been kept balanced the flywheel will probably be OK, but do check the teeth for stepping and wear. If they are too badly notched? Replace the flywheel.

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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 1:38 am

Dear God almighty! I just watched that vid! What the hell was he thinking??? Extraordinary!

Don't do it that way!

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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 4:53 am

Also, to be clear, the clutch on the 2V bikes is the venerable twin plate item. Completely different to the one in that 8V.

If I can stand it I'll try and watch the other two vids. I wonder how many miles/Km this poor thing has done? Being the UK I doubt it's very many so what made him think the clutch needed replacing? Victor on the ADV board just replaced his, (And gave the bike another motor with lower miles.) as it had started to slip but Vic has done around 200,000 miles on his Stelvio! My 2008 got a new clutch in its 2012 motive unit when I was swapping the gearbox out and it was preparing to throw a damper spring in the friction plate after 70,000 Km or so but there was a bad batch of plates in 2011-12. The clutches are usually pretty bulletproof.

My mind is actually a bit boggled by the way this was done! And the thing is this is the SECOND workshop vid I've seen where a seemingly experienced mechanic creates a nightmare for himself and his customer! Both of these shops were in pommyland! It must be something in the water!

The easy way is.

Tank and wings off. (Battery has to come out.)

Brake and rear wheel off with engine supported on its sump. Footrest hangar plates off.

Airbox out, along with TB's as they'll be in need of a clean anyway.

Swingarm off and shock and linkage out. Expect to replace the swingarm bearings and some linkage bearings at least unless they have been regularly serviced.

Disconnect all sensors, wires and hoses. Unbolt clutch slave from back of gearbox, (Easy when the swingarm and shock are out!)

Remove engine mounting bolts.

Support frame and/or lift it while lowering the motive unit. You can do this on your own but it's much easier with an assistant.

Once the motive unit is clear of the frame it can be twisted through 90 degrees and either lifted out to the side and put on the bench or if you're a masochist the starter and gearbox can be unbolted and pulled off while it's balancing on the jack.

There is no need to remove the alternator or timing chest cover! No need to struggle removing studs. No need to risk bending or breaking stuff. It's all very simple.

Many years ago I had a 1200 Sport in that had a rear main leak. For reasons that were entirely my fault I ended up pulling the engine out three times before I remembered WHY it kept leaking! By the third time I could turn the motor off and have the gearbox on the floor separate to the engine in half an hour!

It's NOT rocket surgery!

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Lazlokovacs
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 5:41 am

amen to that.

I've also witnessed some highly questionable clutch replacement sagas in my time.

just take everything off starting from the rear wheel until you get to where you need to be and swing the frame out the way if necessary

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lcjohnny
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 6:14 am

Lazlokovacs wrote:
..... swing the frame out the way ....

Thats the bit that benefits from repetition and experience.

I learnt that if you are doing it single handed the engine/gearbox needs to be supported at front and back so you can twist it to the correct angle both horizontally and vertically then the frame lifts off quite easily
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 4:54 pm

Well, I just wasted another half hour of my life watching the other two episodes of that 'Repair'. I'm now going to spend the rest of the day sitting in the corner sucking my thumb and rocking autistically!

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GhostBullet
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 5:04 pm

From all that, I think I shall best not be too concerned about the impending task.
Prob worthy to source the parts including the timing chain and the like for a little maintainence in due course. 😁
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Pete Roper
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Fri Mar 24, 2023 6:12 pm

At your sort of mileage a freshen up of lots of things probably wouldn't go astray but having done 200,000 Km overhauls on a couple of 1200 Sport 2V's the amount of stuff that was actually still in perfectly serviceable condition was surprising.

One thing if you or anyone else is interested I know the whereabouts of a set of Joe Caruso timing gears that the bloke who originally purchased them has decided he doesn't want. I can put you in touch if you like. These are steel gears, the only sort to have. Joe's stuff is the absolute 'Gold Standard'.

Most of the other stuff to check will be things like chassis and suspension bearings and bushes and your rear shock is probably due for replacement.

The gearboxes seem damn near impregnable and as long as the pinion nut is tight the bevel gears should last well beyond the time the last star finally flickers out in the universe! Probably check the cardan shaft UJ's and replace if needed but really, they're a tough old bird.

Honestly the camchain would be my primary concern right now but if you pull the motive unit you can do all aff the 'Difficult' stuff on the bench saving a lot of concrete grovelling, back pain and cursing.

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Lazlokovacs
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PostSubject: Re: GRiSO Clutch   GRiSO Clutch Icon_minitime1Sat Mar 25, 2023 10:22 am

not to agree with everything pete says, but I have a set of the Caruso steel gears in one of my tontis and they're great. But actually marginally heavier than the stock chains and sprockets
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